Initial Failure Rate of Modern Electronic Boilers

Perry,

First off, I'm sorry to hear that you a hard time with the Vitodens install due to the faulty wiring. Viessmann would do well to install a idiot light on the Vitodens to point out that kind of problem. They're cheap, reliable, and allow the contractor to save a couple hours of soul-searching as in your case.

It's also less than fun to have to remedy OEM mistakes on your own nickel and dime. But, at 6 hours, it's relatively modest in scope compared to some teething pains that US mod-con boilers experienced. Between loose gas connections, faulty blowers, miswired connections, and other issues, there are plenty of design and implementation problems to ensure that every manufacturer gets a black eye, if you look hard enough.

So, as angry or disappointed as you are to receive a defective piece of equipment, consider that the representative did stop by to assist the installer, found the problem, and corrected it. From now on, I'd expect your experience with the Vitodens to be just as positive as that of the homeowners I know who own one.

Allow me to disagree...

If you don't like the condition of a product being shipped to you, it is your right to refuse delivery and ask for another one. My Vitocell somehow made it through without marks, dents or other issues. Then again, I am much closer to their Warwick distribution warehouse than you are... and given how I have seen some shippers handle their product, I'm surprised that more is not broken by the time it arives on site.

Most memorable was the first-hand account of heatpumps being readied for installation in a large new subdivision in Maryland. Why bother with lifting the units off the back of the trailers when kicking them out as you go gets the job done too? How far should the responsibility of the manufacturer go when gross abuse like this happens?

As for your Mercedes analogy, I believe it is faulty as it would only apply if you imported the car yourself. If you buy the car at a US dealership, then the car company "owns" the problem right up to the point when you take ownership of the car. Thus if there are gouges, dents, etc. then that's something the dealership, MB, and the shipper have to resolve, not you.

Interesting Viewpoint

I guess we have to agree to disagree.

And, until Viessmann or Mercedes "own" the distribution chain the way Lennox does, I wouldn't compare their distribution strategy. Like all US manufacturers I know of, Viessmann distributes via wholesalers, to local distributors, to contractors.

Mercedes does not "own" the outlets either, they simply "own" the product until it's in the hands of the local dealership. Thus, while it takes distribution a step further than Viessmann, it still doesn't control the final point of sale like Lennox is attempting to.

So, as I see it, Viessmann has as little control over their distribution chain as any other manufacturer retailing via the same kinds of retailers. How else would Steve Ebels find hacked Vitolas in his neck of the woods? And who called him to fix the mess?

For that matter, if Viessmann distribution was as tight as you describe it, why on earth would they have allowed a company with a zero record of installing Vitodens', no Vitodens I&O factory training, and a owner that publicly criticizes all things Viessmann buy and install one?

??

Noel,

First off, I apologize unreservedly for offending you. That was not my intention.

Hopefully, you can put your apparent emnity for me behind you some day. I very much wish for the two of us to get along; I appreciate your thoughtful commentary on steam and other heating systems. With help from experts like yourself I believe that Slant/Fin will continue to thrive... there is no reason that a US manufacturer couldn't compete worldwide in the hydronic heating arena.

It may strike you as odd, but my interest in the Bobcat is genuine, since it'll be the one of the few "homegrown" condensing/modulating boilers on the market. Most US manufacturers simply private-label EU mod-con wares or assemble their mod-cons from parts largely sourced overseas.

I believe that this approach puts them at a potential disadvantage to local producers for several reasons. Yet, despite announcing the product in the past, there is no info for the Bobcat on the Slant/Fin site. Can you give us an update on when it will be released (if it hasn't been already) and what the specs are?

As for the shill characterization, I disagree with it because the definition of shill does not match my affiliation with Viessmann. Plus, I frequently mention other brands like Buderus, Burnham, HTP, NYT, TT, etc. as well. But if you want to believe that I get paid by Viessmann to tout their wares, I can't stop you.

So, once again I hold out my hand in friendship and hope you take it. Cheers!