Steam Heat Questions

Gary Burrell

I have a small 2 bedroom story and a half house heated with steam. Over the last few years I have struggled with proper heating and balancing of the system so I am looking for some advice.

The basics:

Furnace is about 10 years old and is serviced every year. It was installed by the previous owner.

Piping is mostly cast except for the copper where the furnace is plumbed into the system (I know copper shouldn't be used to pipe in steam but I had nothing to do with it)

It's a single pipe system I've Insulated all the (outgoing) steam pipes.

I've tried every thing and am unable to balance the system. Downstairs is large radiators on which I've installed large vents. Upstairs is much smaller radiators on which I've tried small vents and last year went with adjustable vents which I placed in the closed position (they still vent a little).

The main problem is in order to keep my downstairs around 70 my upstairs get up to 80 or more on cold days. Last year I took to using my AC air handler to circulate the air on cold days.

The house is plaster inside and currently only the attic and the kitchen downstairs are insulated but that will be fixed shortly which may help the problem. (and at least reduce my fuel bills).

Any suggestions on what to do.

At this stage I'm very close to looking at converting to hot water. I could snake a homerun of PEX to the upstairs for each room, replace the radiators, install a manifold and zone it so it only goes up to 65 or so. The downstairs would be easy to convert and would then be a seperate zone. I know this is drastic but given the cost of fuel and the fact I am currently overheating my upstairs I'm beginning to think it may be worth it.

will smith_4

Since the upstairs is further from the boiler, you might try using vents with the larger ports there, with smaller vents on the rads closer to the boiler; this might even out the heating rate a bit for you. You also need to make sure your main vent (you do have one, right?) is working. What is the operating control set at? While I'm at it, where's the stat located?

Gary Burrell

I've tried larger vents but following the advice here went with larger vents on the larger radiators (downstairs), Smaller upstairs on the smaller radiators. The problem is I'm getting too much heat upstairs (which from what I read means they should vent slower). I've even tried shutting the upstairs radiators off but the valves don't seem to close completely so all I manage to do is stop the water from returning and flood the radiators.

There is no main vent in my system (never has been from what I can see)

The thermostat is located in the first floor living room. It is set to 60 during the day, 70 in the evening and 65 at night. The upstairs often gets to 80+ in the evenings in the winter.

clammy

t stat

First a couple of question where your t stat located on your first floor and is it located by the stairs going to the 2 nd floor .Also do you find that most of the heat upstairs may just be floating up your stairs towards your a/c return .If the second floor rad isn't totally hot and your 1 st floor rad is hot then it's just a matter of hot air rises try to tighten your home up window upgrades .i have seen this happen before espicaly with a return air grills located in 2 nd floor high temp to low temp you may also have issues with solar heat gains in the room that's overheating .What type of vents are you using peace clammy

Gary Burrell

The Downw stairs Rads are 2X in depth and
about the same length x width of the upstairs
(except the bathroom which is about 1/2 width)

Layout is as follows (i tried to draw an ASCII
picture but the forrmatting messes it up)

Front to back living room with 2 Rads on outside side
wall and stairs to 2nd floor on back wall. TStat
on middle of center wall next to doorway to DR.
upstairs 2BR and bath all off small hall at top
of stairs.

Air Intake is upstairs, but I only started circulating the air as a bandaid.


Vents are maid-o-mist self adjustable with D size
holes downstairs. Upstairs was maid-o-mist tried both
large and small holes but now upstairs are adjustable (in closed)position. Heat is coming from the upstairs radiators
(even with vents in closed position they really pump out
the heat)


Windows are old double hungs with storms all around except in the upstiars right bedroom which are new. Next step is
blown in insulation which hopefully might stop some heat loss, but I'm not sure it will help my balance problem.

House isn't drafty it just seems that the upstairs radiators
put out way more heat than the downstairs. I've tried turning them off but the shutoffs still seam to let in the
steam and then they just fill with water.

I've been thinking also of putting Danfoss TVR's upstairs but I'm not sure it will solve my problem.

bob young

radiators might be wrong sizes for rooms

Steve Sawyer

Main Vents/ Oversized boiler

I have a 2-pipe steam system. The only vent I can find is a single bullet-shaped small-orifice vent coming off of the return line. It whistles at least slightly all the time-- more loudly if boiler firing or if blowing down the boiler. Is this my system's version of a main vent? If so, should I get a bigger vent? Should I tap in with additional main vents? (My main is only about 10 feet long, and tees off twice.)
Also, my 60's-era American Standard boiler is rated for 933 square feet, whereas I have only 560 sq. feet of radiator heating surface. Should I simply get a new, smaller boiler, or are there any measures I can take to compensate for apparent mis-sizing? Thanks.

gerry gill

i would try

the danfoss trv's..if its to hot, they will just keep that radiator off.

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Steamhead (in transit)

Gary, something is keeping the steam

from reaching your first-floor radiators as it should. This could be any number of things, including but not limited to:

Radiator runouts off-pitch (due to house settling, may have been this way for years)

System got flooded up to the first-floor level, washing debris into the runouts

System running at too much pressure which can blow those Maid-o-Mist "D" vents closed. To distribute steam properly thru the system at low pressures, you need properly sized main vents. Then you can use smaller vents on radiators which won't have this problem. In the coal-fired days you could get away without main vents but not with today's oil and gas boilers. Fortunately they're pretty easy to add.

First-floor radiators may be connected to the mains downstream of second-floor ones, so steam rises to the second floor first. This is another place where main vents help a lot.

One-pipe steam is incredibly simple, so whatever ails it can be easily fixed. No need to rip it out.

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