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Mechanic wanted...great opportunity.

I would think it should not be allowed, I was encouraging my men to stop in here to do some reading,

I definately wont now

Comments

  • JohnNYJohnNY Posts: 2,389Member
    Is this allowed?

    Plumbing & Heating Technician - Local 1 Service Division Co. Looking To Hire And Sponsor Qualified Plumbing & Heating Service Mechanic For Work In Manhattan, Brooklyn. Applicants Must Have A Minimum Of 5 Yrs Service Experience Installing, Trouble Shooting & Repairing Steam & Hot Water Heating Systems & Residential Plumbing. Clean Drivers License & References A Must. Excellent Pay, Union Benefits, Paid Vacation & Holidays. Steady Work & Overtime For Reliable, Presentable & Ambitious Qualified Applicants. Call 800-723-6890

    To Learn More About This Professional, Click Here to Visit Their Ad in "Find A Professional"
    For installations, troubleshooting, and private consulting services, find John "JohnNY" Cataneo here at :
    "72°F Mechanical, LLC"
    Or email John at [email protected]
    John is the Boilers and Hydronic Heating Systems Course Instructor at NYC's Mechanics Institute, a professional Master Plumber, licensed by The Department of Buildings of The City of New York, and works extensively in NYC while consulting for clients in and out of state.
    John also oversees mechanical installations and maintenance for metro-area clients with his family's company, Gateway Plumbing and Heating along with his brother/business partner.
  • Big EdBig Ed Posts: 1,117Member
    Scale

    John , what is pay scale & Pension for Local 1 ?
  • Big EdBig Ed Posts: 1,117Member
    With All Do Respect

    What are you afraid of ?
  • Larry SavinoLarry Savino Posts: 63Member


    Its not what I am afraid of,I am tired of trying to educate my staff,By sending them out to classes,seminars,Webpages, Only to have some self serving person decide thats where there going to solict his work staff. What better staff to solict then guys who are looking to get a proper education.

    So Again. I am not afraid of anything, It just sickens me that this happens in every educational program available, Myself or my parter addend every educational class we send our guys to to indroduce ourselfs to other buisness owners who feel its a good place to look for potential employees.

    Me personally think its selfish
  • JohnNYJohnNY Posts: 2,389Member
    Mr. Savino,

    I completely understand what you're saying, but this site is read by people all over the world. A "help wanted" ad is for someone who lives within about a 20 mile radius of the poster.
    Chances are, no two contractors on this site are taking each other's employees.

    I'd like to leave it to the authorities to dictate policy.

    Regards,
    John



    To Learn More About This Professional, Click Here to Visit Their Ad in "Find A Professional"
    For installations, troubleshooting, and private consulting services, find John "JohnNY" Cataneo here at :
    "72°F Mechanical, LLC"
    Or email John at [email protected]
    John is the Boilers and Hydronic Heating Systems Course Instructor at NYC's Mechanics Institute, a professional Master Plumber, licensed by The Department of Buildings of The City of New York, and works extensively in NYC while consulting for clients in and out of state.
    John also oversees mechanical installations and maintenance for metro-area clients with his family's company, Gateway Plumbing and Heating along with his brother/business partner.
  • STEVE PAUL_3STEVE PAUL_3 Posts: 126Member
    education

    Larry, would you be better off NOT training, educating and sending your people off to seminars, and then have them stay with you and remain ignorant? Education and training is an ongoing, never ending process in any trade, craft or skill. You became educated and smarter as you grew in the trade, are you still with the same company you started with? It comes with the territory.
  • EricjeeperEricjeeper Posts: 179Member
    How to keep a man from Jumping ship

    The way I see it.. if a man is happy with his employer, due to a comparable wage.. good bennies, and a respectable atmosphere. He will not have any desire to jump ship..
    Here in central Indiana I know of a mechanical company that has trained more HVAC guys and plumbers than probably any other company in the state, then they lose the guys cause their pay is not up to par..
    And yes the world is about money.. we all need it, we all want as much as we can get. Don't we?
    I am a carpenter., been with the same company for 11 years.. but this winter work was lean for me.. trust me if I could have a found a passing ship, I would have been aboard.
    I do specialty work and currently not much competition in the Indy area.. so it will be hard to jump ships and stay in the same line of work.. sorry just had to vent
  • Dick_3Dick_3 Posts: 60Member


    Respectfully, if your worried about losing your good employees to your competeition, it's a shame to say but your pay scale and benefit package may be a little light.

    To expect loyal, well trained, motivated employees, the company has to be loyal to the good employees and their families.

    Our pay scale is $30.00 per hour in the check, company paid benefits including very good health care, dental, eye care, pension (3.50/hr), and retirement annuinty (2.45/hr), overtime after 8 hour, and steady work (40 hrs plus per week).

    We don't worry about sending our employees anywhere and actually promote them to check out other employers offers, nobody has quit yet.

    QMS is looking for service mechanics at this time, send us a resume.

    How about starting a poll on this site to list the wages and bene's offered by each company? I think wages and benefits packages shouldn't be a secret. Let the cream rise to the top.





    To Learn More About This Professional, Click Here to Visit Their Ad in "Find A Professional"
  • DanHolohanDanHolohan Posts: 14,860Member, Moderator, Administrator
    I agree

    Whether a person sees a solicitation here or in the newspaper, or hears it on the radio (GEM Plumbing does that in Rhode Island) he or she is not going to leave if they're happy where they are.

    I have no problem with John's post.
    Retired and loving it.
  • Eugene SilbersteinEugene Silberstein Posts: 1,380Member
    I got a call

    I got a call about a year ago from the supervisor of one of my students in the HVAC/R program at the college. He was very upset that one of his technicians was going to school to get an education. I though that this was very strange as most would think that would be a plus to have dedicated individuals who would take it upon themselves to better their understanding of their indistry.

    The employer went on to tell me that, since this technician was going to school to get "smarter" he would likely leave and either go into business for himself or go work for another company.

    I told him, as others have eluded to in earlier posts that, if he is inscure and worried about having this technician leave, me might very well be undercompensating his people. If you are indeed paying your technicians what they are worth, and maybe even a few dollars more than that, there is a very small chance that they will wander. Of course, the monetary issue is only part of the equation. Being treated with respect, benefits and other perks also play a role.

    I also told the employer that, if he feels his compensation is fair, he has two choices...Educate your techs and take the risk that they leave or.... Don't educated them and gurantee yourself that they will stay!
  • gerry gillgerry gill Posts: 2,962Member
    Scott, it sounds like you have

    a great place to work! i wish you the best in prosperity this year..its great to see a company treat their staff well..

    To Learn More About This Professional, Click Here to Visit Their Ad in "Find A Professional"
    gwgillplumbingandheating.com

    Serving Cleveland's eastern suburbs from Cleveland Heights down to Cuyahoga Falls.

  • MR Savino...

    Whatever you do, do NOT send your employees to Red Rocks Community College. THere is a BULLETIN board with ALL kinds of jobs, with posts showing hourly rates and signing bonuses and EVERYTHING...

    Your complaint seems a bit silly to me...

    Are your employees told to NOT go on the internet as a part of them employment agreement with you? God forbid that they Google a job wanted questionaire or something...

    If you are THAT worried, maybe you need to review your employment practices.

    ME
  • Boiler GuyBoiler Guy Posts: 585Member
    I feel the need to weigh in on this subject

    I am on the other side of this debate.

    I completely agree with all of the foregoing information. My financial package is quite satisfactory and has been for most of my tenure. I have always participated in any available training, with or without Company support. I thouht I could remain a contributing member of this organization for many more years. Even with all of the opportunities that may still be available to me, I have recently decided (Thursday) it is necessary to move on. Why?

    After 11 years of never being short of work, I see the handwriting on the wall. New management has decided to compromise customer safety and security by permitting questionable work and practices to become an unacceptable percentage (according to my standards)of daily activities. Numerous conversations about this situation have failed to entice any corrective action.

    I feel am left with no alternative. Over the years I have become the "field face" (fortunately/unfortunately) of the organization. Dealing with unsolicited negative feedback has now become part of my daily routine. I know for a fact and have been specifically told some clients will move and/or follow upon my departure. I recognize this most likely will create a strain on the existing organization. I would like to make the break clean , however I still need to feed my family.

    I would jump at the chance to work in the hydronic and steam environments "out East" I read about daily in this forum. However, due to borders this is not a viable option, as far as I know.

    So there you have it! It is not all about compensation. After many years in this industry holding myself to a high standard, I feel I am now being forced to make a choice between responsibility to my customers and a chosen carreer path.

    Suggestions gratefully appreciated.
  • DaveGatewayDaveGateway Posts: 568Member
    Techs jumping ship

    Mr. Savino, I'm JohnNY's partner (and brother). Someone asked what the pay scale was, and like Scott already posted, it's a package worth 85k a year, before overtime, on call $$,company-paid training, etc. In my neighborhood there's a company that's emblazoned a "Help Wanted-$5,000 signing bonus" on all their vehicles. We're all vying for the same dwindling pool of qualified guys. That's reality. As a business model - If you think your going to keep your people from leaving by keeping them ignorant of their opportunities you're in good company. Kim Jung Il, Fidel Castro and some Mullahs spring instantly to mind.
  • ralmanralman Posts: 231Member
    Wow!

    I have a coworker (We're not currently in any HVAC or related type industry) who is a new hire. We were talking and trying to get to know each other. He told me he attended Triangle Tech in Pittsburgh for HVAC. He said he finished school and worked for 4 different companies in our area for about 5 years. I was impressed with his credentials but I had to ask him why he changed careers. He told me he never made more than 8 dollars an hour, and There weren't any benefits. He also talked a lot about the poor treatment he received from employers and coworkers. Prior to our discussion, I had always thought that an HVAC career would be a great way to spend your life. I was left with the impression that it would not be a rewarding occupation as well as difficult to support a family. Like others have posted, Take care of your employees and their families. They may jump clean out of the profession.
  • Mitch_6Mitch_6 Posts: 549Member
    My argument is when

    an employee is paid (dollars are for example only) $5.00 an hour but his performance justifies the pay. Then he sees an add or hears another person is making $10.00 per. He comes back wants a raise. if you do not give it he goes to the other company. Gem for instance is very very performance oriented. Your $5.00 per guy cant hack it there but now wont go back neither do you want him back after the mistrust. I have seen it happen more this way than a company actually getting the $10.00 person they wanted. All three parties suffer in these cases

    I constantly get "the other guys" are getting paid X why cant I get paid that but they also are self blinded to the mass of employees that are getting paid less with less benefits or job security.

    I have seen several cases where we send our people to school "Pay for it" just for the instructors that work there that also have there own companies use that situation for recruiting. They are taking advantage of there position.

    Mitch S.

    To Learn More About This Professional, Click Here to Visit Their Ad in "Find A Professional"
  • Mark HuntMark Hunt Posts: 4,909Member
    Would I get


    to work at You-Know-Who's house??? OHHH BABY!!!

    Mark H

    To Learn More About This Professional, Click Here to Visit Their Ad in "Find A Professional"
  • rich pickeringrich pickering Posts: 277Member


    > I am on the other side of this debate.

    >

    > I

    > completely agree with all of the foregoing

    > information. My financial package is quite

    > satisfactory and has been for most of my tenure.

    > I have always participated in any available

    > training, with or without Company support. I

    > thouht I could remain a contributing member of

    > this organization for many more years. Even with

    > all of the opportunities that may still be

    > available to me, I have recently decided

    > (Thursday) it is necessary to move on.

    > Why?

    >

    > After 11 years of never being short of

    > work, I see the handwriting on the wall. New

    > management has decided to compromise customer

    > safety and security by permitting questionable

    > work and practices to become an unacceptable

    > percentage (according to my standards)of daily

    > activities. Numerous conversations about this

    > situation have failed to entice any corrective

    > action.

    >

    > I feel am left with no alternative.

    > Over the years I have become the "field face"

    > (fortunately/unfortunately) of the organization.

    > Dealing with unsolicited negative feedback has

    > now become part of my daily routine. I know for a

    > fact and have been specifically told some clients

    > will move and/or follow upon my departure. I

    > recognize this most likely will create a strain

    > on the existing organization. I would like to

    > make the break clean , however I still need to

    > feed my family.

    >

    > I would jump at the chance to

    > work in the hydronic and steam environments "out

    > East" I read about daily in this forum. However,

    > due to borders this is not a viable option, as

    > far as I know.

    >

    > So there you have it! It is not

    > all about compensation. After many years in this

    > industry holding myself to a high standard, I

    > feel I am now being forced to make a choice

    > between responsibility to my customers and a

    > chosen carreer path.

    >

    > Suggestions gratefully

    > appreciated.



  • Eugene SilbersteinEugene Silberstein Posts: 1,380Member
    If Instructors are Recruiting

    If instructors are recruiting for their own companies, I would definitely speak to the institution and inform them of this situation.

    As an HVAC/R educator for 14 plus years, I have always helped those new to the industry find viable employment in the industry. I have also made it a point to let those who are already working in the industry to know how lucky they are to have employers that are willing to invest in their future. After all, it is the employers who send a great deal of our students to us.

    It seems counter productive for an employer to pay for technicians to go to school only to have them stolen from them by the very individiuals who are providing the education. This sounds like a great topic of discussion that I will bring up at our ARI national instructor's meeting in April.
  • Larry SavinoLarry Savino Posts: 63Member


    You know I am quite surprised by the response to my comments, But Dan owns the site and he doesn’t see a problem with it and so we all have the answer. It’s O.K to solicit worker on the wall. I thought it was meant for technical problems but I understand its an evolving Bulletin board.
    What’s most shocking to me is the responses, I think the majority are insulting and in mean spirit
    I take care of my workers well, I pay for there classes, I personally take the time to train them every Wednesday morning, I go out in the field to train them.
    Our compensation package is second to none. We offer top wages, 401k, Medical, Prescription, Eyes Glasses, A cafeteria plan to help them with there medical costs, Uniforms, Full time work, An educational reimbursement for all classes taken with a passing grade, Company wide profit sharing that since in effect we have never put in less then $70,000.00. Each and every installation job we do is job costed and the guys get a performance bonus for every job they bring in over the estimated GP. I start a college saving plans for our employees who become parents; I purchase life insurance for them also. I could go on but I won’t.
    Its just frustrating to have to deal with some one soliciting my employee when I am trying to give them and education. I don’t fault the employee for trying to do better for there family, I actually tell them to bring me the deal the other company is offering. I sit down with the employee and go thru the compensation package piece by piece, I show them the difference in the medical plans, I also show them not all companies pay the same part of the medical coverage. If they have a better deal I wish them the best of luck I never lost a family Man to another company, The majority of out mechanics’ are with us over 10 years, All of our middle management is with us 15 years and more. We are only a young company 18years old. I would say we have a great compensation package.
    The point I was trying to make is I FEEL solicitation for employees at an educational place is out of line. Unless your invited to speak to the students at a vocational school. So you can continue to throw stones and insult me, But someday when a guy comes in and give you his 2 weeks notice because another company offered him a dollar more an hour at the last class you paid him to go to, you may rethink your position on it.
    Larry



  • hrhr Posts: 6,106Member
    Money can't buy me love, can't buy me...

    I agree some replies were hard hitting. Hard to tell via the www.

    But I have to agree you may be missing the point. If an employee leaves you for a buck an hour I'd guess it was more than money that made them walk.

    Then again it doesn't sound like employees are leaving you, so where is the problem??

    hot rod

    To Learn More About This Professional, Click Here to Visit Their Ad in "Find A Professional"
  • Larry SavinoLarry Savino Posts: 63Member


    Hotrod my problem is entirely the princable of it.

  • Dave_4Dave_4 Posts: 1,405Member


    wow sounds like i should give up welding and get into hvac i all ready love it so much :-) it sounds like it could be a good job for me

    thanks
    Jason
  • hrhr Posts: 6,106Member
    But Larry

    you got the same, if not better plug for your company!!

    What if one of John NY guys comes to your shop to apply??

    And I'd be willing to bet some of your current employees were employed elsewhere before they came to work for you. I doubt you grow your own :)

    hot rod

    To Learn More About This Professional, Click Here to Visit Their Ad in "Find A Professional"
  • Larry SavinoLarry Savino Posts: 63Member


    Hot rod the difference is I am not here to solicit other companies employees in what I consider an educational environment.

    You know I used to always say we dont hire mechanics we make them, But one of our new hires took offence to it,
  • DanHolohanDanHolohan Posts: 14,860Member, Moderator, Administrator
    You sound like a winner to me, Larry.

    On the home page it reads, "Got Questions? The Wall is the place to get your answers?" John's question was to people who might want to work for him.

    I don't see how many would want to leave you. You're doing all the right things, and like you said, a family guy would always choose to stay. Maturity.

    H.R. is also right about you getting a great plug for your place by your post. I think you should name your company and its location. Be fine by me. Pride.

    I also think you should have a Find a Pro ad. There are many homeowners reading this thread right now.

    Peace.
    Retired and loving it.
  • The Wire NutThe Wire Nut Posts: 405Member
    It Pays To Wander on The Wall...

    Then again there are guys like me who are dying to get into this business, (my plight was even written up by Dan for PM a year or so ago), but lack the necessary experience to compete for the job (even though I live down the block from the shop in question!).

    But through these postings, it's clear to see that there is a lot of opportunity in this field and there are a lot of great employers (Larry and John are prime examples of how ALL employers should treat their professionals), and, although it might be somewhat galling to some, I think, in the end, it is educational and even necessary...

    And from that will come opportunities for me, and for others who may wander on the wall, and see that it is a professional field, well-paid, challanging and not just snaking people's toilets...

    Alex ("The Wire-Nut")
    "Let me control you"





    Lost in SOHO NYC and Balmy Whites Valley PA
  • lchmblchmb Posts: 2,957Member
    great plug heck

    Now I want to go to work for Larry, I'm crossing my finger's hoping he's in the northeast!!
  • Tom R.Tom R. Posts: 139Member
    Right, Hot Rod -

    A good friend who owns an HVAC Co. will put his people to work cleaning the shop and sorting fittings, etc. when times are lean, to keep from laying them off. He will price jobs at close to cost to keep them working. He is a union shop, so no one leaves for more money. They know he doesn't have to do this for them, and they return the loyalty. Could be the difference between other companies and his is that he was once a mechanic who left to go on his own because HE was not treated well.
  • LeoLeo Posts: 767Member
    All of these posts

    All of these posts prove something. Instead of being willing to train new people and helping to build the work force everyone wants to compete for the workers already here. It looks like a double edge sword. Not enough people yet no one wants to train a new one. Granted some will leave but you will never find that diamond in the rough if you aren't willing to dig for it.

    Leo
  • Wayco Wayne_2Wayco Wayne_2 Posts: 2,472Member
    I agree

    Things have been nip and tuck for me this Winter. Maybe if I knew where the good jobs were I'd take down my shingle and go to work for someone else. WW

    To Learn More About This Professional, Click Here to Visit Their Ad in "Find A Professional"
  • Mitch_6Mitch_6 Posts: 549Member
    Takes lots of digging to find a diamond in

    the rough, the few I have found very soon go on there own or to much larger companies.

    I run a very small company, pay my people well.
    health, vacation, sep retirement plan 100%company contribution. Pay for education and license fee.

    Few people with any intelligence want to go into the trade unless they come from a family of trades people. The rest want to drive a Lexus, wear a white collared shirt. Work were ther is A/C and Heat.

    I have not been impressed with most of what I have found and throwing dollars at in idiot will not make them a better mechanic.

    Mitch S.

    To Learn More About This Professional, Click Here to Visit Their Ad in "Find A Professional"
  • Boiler GuyBoiler Guy Posts: 585Member
    Never a truer word

    has been spoken. You are ABSOLUTELY CORRECT in your observation. We have the exact same problem.
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