Ready to let go of an old customer..............................

Mad Dog_2

Pride & Honor are key elements of our business dealings. If people can't recognize or respect that, we are not going to desparate measures to find out "WHY" and "HOW" we can shortchange ourselves to "keep" them as a customer. I also concur: they WILL play that hand again. Thanks for great advice. Mad Dog

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Mad Dog_2

Been a good customer for almost 7 years.........................

Treated them well and always tried to shave what I could off bill; many emergencies they never paid full freight for;
kept old boiler going for last few years when they really should have had a new one; Explained how different our boiler job would be from the others. "I know, I know, but I still think its JUST Too high.... we'll let you know...either way," she replied. Actually she has always been quite difficult to deal with...we tolerated her because her husband was always a real gent. Even gave her our asbestos abatement guy and opened the schedule up for her at this crazy time of year. Outstanding work has to be paid for and I will not budge. Its funny, I guess all the magazine articles and books have finally sunk in because............IT DOESN'T BOTHER me anymore. Farewell, Mrs O'Conner

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Ragu_5

Oh Mr. Dog...

Well done, my friend; we can't be the best of the best and save them all. The best customers deserve the best contractors and vice versa.

You have decided to end it, and I support your decision. She will try somebody else and then realise: "UH,oh! I made a big boo boo losing Matt".

Continue to be fair, truthful, honest and sticking up for your integrity and quality of workmanship. You are the best, and you deserve the best. Big smooch for you! Your friend, Jack.

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Al_19

Just wish them well. Tell them to keep your phone number in case they have any problems in the future. Guaranteed you'll have them back as VERY loyal customers.

steve p

When she calls you for service just tell her you charge double for repairs on equipment you didn't install.

Mitch_6

We do it all the time

Long service accounts we have bent backwards over get someone else to do the nice work.

When they call for service after that we ask why they did not call the guy that did the large project.

They typical reply is "well he was OK but we like the way you respond for service better"

Are reply is "well looks like you have a new plumber now better call him".

Sucks but you have to have some pride.

Mitch S.

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steve p

If you are charging enough for service I would still service a boiler I didnt install. I would just give priority to install customers when I was busy. This is business and you cant take things personally.

JB_2

hell yes it bothers you. one way or the other you will be back there. your a good man dog!

mikep7777

Steve's right...

It's just business. The customer thinks they're making the proper decision, in the long run maybe they're screwing themselves, maybe things will work out OK for them. Regardless, if things do go south, you'd rather be the guy that they miss instead of the guy that won't help them out; when they're bitching to their friends, you'd rather be portrayed as the choice they should have made instead of part of the problem.

Of course, you should still prioritize your full-service customers, and make sure your prices reflect their status...

jp_2

kick em!!!

why kick someone just because they can not afford one of your systems, dosen't seem professional.....

S Ebels

The other side of the coin

What makes them think they can't afford the quality of Matt's work?

Short answer, they don't understand that it's not just pipes. They don't understand that all wrench slingers are NOT created equal. Tough to communicate that fact to people looking at two quotes for what they percieve to be the same thing.

JB_2

hey look , everything is up, people on fxed income, look what we go thru, taxe's , insurance, fuel, everybody is looking to cut corners.but good service & installs are hard to find.maybe see what she is getting. look it over. 7 years sounds like you have a relation.

Joe Grosso

I do take it personal

When you are a small shop or one man band you take this type of stuff very personal.Someone said it is just business.When the customer talks to you on a first name bases and then gives their business to someone else for a low ball price if it be a install or a fuel price.I know I get mad.They forget all the times you bent over backwards and let some chargeable calls go.Mad Dog the hell with her your to good.Sometime just have to have a strong stomach for what we have to put up with.

Rodney Summers

customers: you win some...you lose some ...and then some, remenber there is always another heating guy, Be thankful for the money already earned and move on.

Maine Ken

Long time customer finally had the fd-12 give up the ghost. Gave her a price. She would call me next week when I could squeeze her in. Never heard from her. This was 2 weeks before Thanksgiving. She called today because she needed service on a property. As I am in her office getting the details she smiles real nice and tells me that she had her mate and a "buddy" drop a boiler in "at cost", and I quote "that's ok because you can still service it". Next she is on the phone with an associate and tells him that I will service his stuff and that I do ALL of her heating needs.

Not anymore. If I am not good enough, not cheap enough, etc to get the gravy, then I am not interested in the beans anymore.

There are too many faithful customers out there to take up time with the cherry pickers. Why on earth should I follow after discount dan and unlicensed larry? If they can install "at cost" then let them service "at cost".

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Mad Dog_2

I agree buddy

especially us small shops. EVERYONE takes it personally, but it sounds better to say...."its just business." True enough it is there prerogative to not use us, and when all is said and done it is just business. However, the next time they need something....I WILL MAKE A BUSINESS DECISION - NOT to service them: "sorry, Mrs O'Conner, but its just business." Don't get me wrong, if someone comes back and admits their mistake all is forgiven, and sometimes they do become your loyalist customer. Mad Dog

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Mad Dog_2

Is it professional to work for less than the job costs to do?

JP??????? I've got it........NEXT time, I'll LET THE HO NAME THE PRICE. A guy like you would love that, correct? We've been down this road before JP. By The way, what business are YOU in? Mad Dog

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Josh M.

Let's face it. If we don't charge for every minute we spend WORKING for someone else we are going to be out of business.

Just charge her what YOU deserve. And don't apologize. I am sure gravity will do the rest!

I simpathize brother.

Josh

John L

This has struck a chord

and it is not easy or fun when it happens to you and as you can see there are numerous reactions to it. Is it business, yeah sure it is cloaked as business decision, but to me it is personal, especially when I have provided service or otherwise above the call of duty and they have not been charged for it, and let's be honest here folks we all do this at some point. Last week a similar situation happened to me, the Ho got a side job done after my visit and when I found out I called and told them that I take it personally when I lose work to side jobbers. After taking 3 or 4 quotes, he said my was the one that made sense, so his buddy was over( conveniently)and he knew someone that did side jobs, so he got it done that way. I told him that if he has an issue with the new unit he can call the bloke who put it in. I am a understanding guy, however I have no time for this kind of stuff. This is probably the one type of posting that generates the most heated reaction because we have all been affected by this sonewhere along the line. I guess they don't call you Mad Dog for nothing.
Chin up old boy!!

John L

Mad Dog_2

thank you sir

mad dog

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Mad Dog_2

Thank you John.............................

Yes, you are right on all counts. One of my faults is leading with my chin. I am an open book in every way....and that often does not bode well in business. Mad Dog

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Mad Dog_2

and...tell us something about you.....JP......

Mad Dog

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bordy

Maybe all she could afford was the cheap job. Maybe she is moving in a year and doesnt care about quality.
It is fine to cherry pick customers if you can, but if you can, you shouldn't cry when you loose a job.

Cosmo_3

Not easy

I come from a big family, and I have a lot of cousins and aunts and uncles. A small shop owner's customer base is like the extended family, well at least the good ones who actually pay for you to come over and fix stuff.

My point is that I feel that all my customers are just an extension of my family. In my time I have seen customers that started out full of life, and able to afford my services, and even say what a value it is. Then follow them through lost jobs, layoffs, sicknesses, cancer, and I have even attended a few funerals. Like it or not in a small shop any customer we have a few years of history with can make us feel emotional. I can tell that, yes you say good riddance but inside you still feel like you are letting her down. That because you are not just a businessman, but also a good person with good morals.

Your doing the right thing, and the fact that you feel bad just means your human big guy. Stay the course Dog. You are running a business to feed your family, and one day she may call back after paying less for more headaches because she knows that you are a competant tradesman.

If you still feel bad then go through your bills for next month........


Cosmo

Mark Hunt

Matt Sweeney


does not cry over lost jobs Bordy.

You do not know what you're talking about.

Mark H





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Mark Hunt

Can't or


won't JP?

Afford Matt that is.

You know this how?

Mark H

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Cosmo_3

I agree

Do you even know Matt Mr. Bordy?

What is up with the attitude here lately.....


Cosmo

[Deleted User]

Matt, a business man has to do what a business man has to do...

We can not be "everyones" contractor. Most people can't afford to do things cheap,but they fail to realize that, especially when dealing with people who really have no freakin' idea what they are doing in business and cut our installed prices by half. And they come to this realization when its too late.

Not your problem.

You presented the facts, you did your best. Sometimes the consumer can't see the forest for the trees. All they see are the $ signs, and they fail to perceive the real value behind a true craftsman like yourself. The fact that you don't feel good about it proves that you are human, and not cold hearted as some (jp) would like to believe.

We all have to make these decisions in business, and its not a win/win situation for all concerned including the low baller that gets the job. He'll be stuck with the hammering albatross hanging around his neck for the rest of his business life, which is probably less than the warranty of the boiler.

Follow your gut. It's right 99.9% of the time. Time to hold your head high and move on.

NEXT...

ME

tim smith

servicing non install clients

I decided along time ago that not all can afford my installs or need to. If they have someone else install a boiler and then can't get service, I will take care of them in most instances. As long as the job was done properly and to code I will normally service it for them at a reasonable rate as I treat all others. Just doing what we can. Tim

Maine Ken

Tim, do you feel the same way if it is a long time client of yours. five, ten years of servicing the equipment faithfully and then someone else does the replacement/ upgrade?

I service equipment installed by others almost everyday. That is what I do. My feelings change when the loyalty doesn't flow both ways.

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brucewo1b

Ken

I understand your reasoning but we also have had a few stray but come back home once they realize that the bottom line is about heat not dollar bills.

Howard Emerson

Hey Dog,
That's a tough call, you know?

Years ago when I worked for the Sam Ash Music Store chain in NYC, Jerry Ash told me "Howard, the best 'revenge' is taking the customer's money".

Very frankly, I could not relate to what he said.

If I was feeling I needed 'revenge', that was an easy customer to tell "Sorry, go somewhere else". Other than that, I did the best job I could do to sell them what they really needed.

I'd walk away from this one if she buys elsewhere.

Best,
Howard

ScottMP

Matt

It is tough and its a kick in the gut BUT ... we're big boys and its ONLY BUSINESS. Smile. tell them good luck and when they call you to service it, tell them you'll be over as soon as you can.

Its all about the green. So you don't get the big one, you've been in business long enough to know that small jobs have a bigger margin. Ten small jobs are better than No Big One.

If you fire them, their gone. If you take the high road, they just may go to a party and tell a new customer " We made a mistake going low ball, Call Triple Crown ".

I learned this lesson awhile ago, If the only way they will see your worth is to use the low guy ... so be it. Not all your customers are this way and one of them has to learn the hard way. You'll still be in business next year and a service call will be just fine.

Merry Christmas MadDog.

Scott

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jp_2

you crack me up mad dog...

as you said , you've been charging them less, did I tell you to charge them less?

I asummed you charge them less cause YOU figure they can't afford the regular price. so wouldn't that make sense that they can't afford a full installation?

geeze......So, why does my work have anything to do with you charging someone less than you normally would?

jp_2

i too

work for a women, husband left, left her with 4 kids and a house butched by him. she can't afford my regular prices either. i'll work for lower pay now and then, but not very often. there you happy now, or do you want a tax return and report card too.....

still don't see what I do has anything to do with your post.

Leo G_99

have areally good builder

who we do plumbing/heating installs for. About 4 years ago, he got other prices, mine was 5 grand higher then the winner.

Took the other guys three tries to get the basement loops passed. didn't include hosebibs, undermount sinks, etc. in quote. By the time the dust had settled, they of course were higher then my original bid.

When the next house came up, the builder did not, and has not, even ask for another price.

Sometimes Matt, people just have to see if the grass is really greener on the other side! Most of the time they find out that it was just Astro Turf! I vote that you wait this one out, make your final decision the next time these people call you. (it could be half way through the instal!)

Leo G

R. Swatton

They wouldn’t do it for you.

"They wouldn’t do it for you"


That is my favorite quote. When someone asks me to work for less I ask myself. Would they do the same for me?

Well we all know the answer.



Authorized Heat Tranfer Products Sevice Agent

GW

Mad Dog

Mad Dog, I must weigh in.

Yes, it stinks she bailed.

I fear you may have "conditioned" the Mrs. to be price conscious.

That's the world we live in; we CHOSE this living and hopefully take the good with the bad. The bad days can be REALLY bad, yet the good days can be INCREDIBLE!

I'm really curious: Did you give her several options or just one system to say yes or no to?

When we started offering options (good better best) our sales went north, fast.

You'll get the next one!

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GW

I know the Dog!!

Matt, I may be a bit slow-

we did meet once years ago, was it a Frank Blau thing? c-2000 thing? You gave me an invoice to look at.

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jp_2

geeze mark?

well mad dogs post seems to read they CAN'T afford him, they seem to pay less for service, not sure why you don't read it that way????

Steve_35

One reason why you NEED to charge the same to all clients.

FWIW, we charge everyone the same price since we do flat rate. If someone can't afford it, particularly a nice, elderly person we will give them the repair. IOW, they pay full boat or we don't charge them.

We are NOT enablers. By that I mean we don't limp equipment along. When we feel it needs to be replaced they either choose to replace it or get someone else to service it.

You need to make money on the service end. If you can make what you need to when you service their equipment it stings a whole lot less if they decide to have someone else replace the equipment.

And when they call us to service it we go ahead and service the new equipment at our regular rates because we're making our margins on that.

Don't put yourself in the position where you feel you're doing them a favor by servicing their equipment. Don't limp along equipment that should be replaced. Don't give them discounts. If you feel the need and you feel they're truly needy then give them the repair. Just do it because you want to and don't expect anything back. You'll feel better about it at the end of the day.