2\" Hydrocoil job with shell and tube hx (Ray L)

rumn8r

It's something that my partner and I started using on snowmelt systems about 7 years ago right after we partnered up.

We had one particularly large residential SM system way out in the boon docks that was a tough purge due to the SM system being higher than the air elimination/heat source system. After about the third trip out to the country to recharge the glycol, we came up with the idea of using a reservoir tank fully charged with glycol with a pressure reducing valve on its outlet to take up the slack and make up for volume loss due to air elimination. Works like a champ provided that you get most of the free air chunks out of the system.

It is now a standard feature on ALL of our systems. Whenever possible, we incorporate either a low water cut off or a low pressure cutoff or both depending upon the appliance and application. If you have even the smallest leak in a system, pressure will eventually drop to the point that the system shuts down and the consumer complains. But lets face it. No leak in a closed loop system is a good leak. Find it and fix it fast, or pay the consequences.

A word of caution. If the home is an occasional use home/vacation home, and not regularly occupied, you may want to incorporate some means of a telephone notification service based on fluid pressure, or house temperature or both. If the system goes down and shuts down without supervision, and the house gets cold enough to freeze the plumbing, it could QUICKLY turn into a disaster.

The term PIG stands for Pressure Induced Glycol unit.

On non glycol systems, we refer to it as the FillSafe system. Our insurance company REQUIRES that we do it this way. It is NOT an option.

The code authorities at first glance bristled, but once we explained the operation of the device, and all the safety back ups we incorporate into the system, they applaud and wonder why it is not a standard requirement of ALL hydronic heating contractors.

ME too...

Once a system has gone through air elimination and oxygen stabilization, the pressure remains constant. If there is ever a leak, the most we can lose is the volume in the reservoir tank and the expansion tank. Hardly enough to do a mega dollar insurance claim.

I like the Axion units and the like because you can actually see what kind of fluid you have in reserve. With the PIG and the FillSafe, you only get to see residual pressure in the reservoir tank, which is not indicative of the gallons of reserve left. WHen it get down to around 12 or 15 PSI, the bottom can drop out in a hurry. Hence, our employees are asked to top them off as needed, and make notes in the system manual of their actions so we have a record of required refills that might be indicative of a hidden leak somewhere in the system.

I knew I should have patented this idea while I had the chance...:-)

ME

Ray Landry

Here's a project I did this week at a fitness center. We removed a gas RTU and are installing two vital air air handlers/dehumidification units. I ran 2" pro press lines from the mechanical room to the roof to a newly built dog house for the mechanicals. Cut into the existing buderus SB boiler and hooked up my shell & tube HX. I like the look of steel on the near HX piping but boy, after spinning the wrenches all day you sure do feel it the next day.

Ted_9

Job

Cool job, sounds like fun.

Did you install the Buderus SB? I've always wanted to install one.

To Learn More About This Professional, Click Here to Visit Their Ad in "Find A Professional"

Ray Landry_2

Thanks for the comment Ted, I did not install the SB, a co worker of mine did. They are on nice piece of equipment.

Brad White_141

I particularly like

the glycol storage and expansion tank detail in photo #004. It seems the two tanks are open to one-another with the pressure regulator heading into the system. I assume this is a leak detection/protection feature? Is the storage tank also an expansion tank in fact if not function? Meaning, is it over-filled to above prime system pressure? How is the system valved in normal operation?

Could you please expand on this more, Ray?

We often specify a Neptune glycol feeder (make on pressure drop) or an Axiom unit. This seems less mechanically intensive (not that the others are complicated mind you).

And -dare I ask- with the Propress and Glycol, do you have any concerns? That could be a whole 'nother thread..

Thanks

Brad

Ray Landry_2

Hello Brad how have you been? I was a little bit weary using the pro press on this job as one of mine recently had an issue on a snow melt system with leakage, but I think that it was an alkaline batch of glycol. The glycol storage tank is a 'cheaper' alternitive than the axiom unit. That whole setup is about $200 with guauge, fast fill, ect. I release the charge of the air bladder in the extrol tank, and pump the expansion tank to 80# with my transfer pump. The fast fill is set for 12#'s and an annual inspection records the gauge reading, and drop in pressure is investigated, and recharged. We equip every large glycol job with this set up and also add a low water cut off to kill the mechanical circuit in the event of dry-fire. The two tanks are seperate from eachother in the aspect that the fast fill device regulates the pressure. All valves between the two tanks and the heat system are left normally open.

Brad White_141

Kudos

to you and Ray- you for 'inventing' it and Ray for making it known. In so saying, I take nothing away from either of you!

I love great, simple ideas. I will detail this for our company for small systems. Any idea what we should call it to give credit?

PIG sounds OK but some may take offense

Maybe Glycol Injection Pressure-Powered Etherton Reservoir (GIPPER)?

Mark Etherton Landry Injection Kinetic Extrol (ME LIKE)?

Off to bed for this boy.... way past...

Cheers!

Brad