My 1965 Winkler Boiler has a hole in the refractory?

Boilerpro_5

I may know where one still is!

Boilerpro

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Rich_34

hole in refractory

I was doing my annual cleaning on my boiler and accidently touched the refractory with the vacuum clean, now there is a dime size hole, should I have this repaired? I plan on using this boiler for one more heating season and then switching to a more efficient type. This is a 1965 Winkler/Srewart Warner oil Boiler converted to nat.gas using an Economite burner. I have alot of experience with heating but I have never needed work on a refractory.

Thanks Rich..

J.C.A._3

I bet you...

Could just fit the hole with a piece of kaowool and some waterglass...right in the hole, providing you can reach it.(BTW, we've all heard that "I'm gonna change it next year" line OH SO MANY TIMES, that it's worn out now!)

HMMMM... Let me think back....I believe there is a sight door that is about 4 1/2X 4 1/2 ,right on top of that burner and MY arm used to fit right in there to clear the bottom of the refractory on oil fired boilers.

If not...don't worry about it too much. These were among THE most forgiving boilers ever made. If the neighbors saw the
black smoke" pouring out of the chimney...we still had a few days until it plugged up! Too bad you never saw the original burner that those beasts came with! Wobble pumps and low pressure nozzles....air injected too! My old boss swore that they would run on anything, including crankcase oil, as long as it was cut with #1 or 2 oil.(I believe the quote would read that they would run on goat pee if given the chance)
They weighed about 140 pounds, all solid cast iron. I think I took the last one in the old town out...about 14 years ago. Chris

Rich_34

Well the hole is dime sized and atleast an inch deep, no way to get my arm in there, well unless I remove the burner. I know whats in there but I have never had this problem, I must say of all the oil fired boilers I've had the un-pleasures of working on this old chunk of iron is in wonderful shape otherwise! No burn thru's, with a good dusting you would think it was installed yesterday, the size of the unit and the 8" flue will let you know.

Dick Charland

I wouldn't worry about it, if it's the model I'm thinking of it's a wet base and chamber really there only for combustion purposes. It was a great boiler in its day. Cleanout in the back, have to take the rear jacket panel off?

The Winkler burners were a hell of a unit, similar concept to the old GE. Worse part was installing a new Beckett and having to carry out the old burner.

Ken_40

The boiler IS wet based, however...

Given its age, that spot may be backed by scale and "mud."

I'd make an attempt to pack a small piece of Kao-Wool with a dab of furnace cement as "glue" to the hole.

This might be accomplished with a three foot "stick," and the patch being fixed to the tip?

Without seeing the hole, I too would wager it will make it through the heating season without a problem. Fact is, if it goes bad, you'll have to make the new boiler installation on Christmas Eve; the time all potential problems become realities (;-o)

Perry_2

What if the patch falls out?

Patching it might work; but the patch may fail and fall off; even potentially brining a larger piece with it.

What will happen if the patch falls off. Will it land on the burner; or just fall to the bottom where it will rest peacefully for the remmainder of its days.

I'd want to make sure that the remaining refractory is in good shape before attempting the patch. If the refractory has deteriorated patching may not get you much (and may make things worse).

It may be best just to leave it be; and see what happens. Who knows... it may go for years yet.


Perry

Leo

My question is

My question is if gas burns so clean why did he have to vacumn it in the first place?

Leo

Rich_34

Thank you for all the advice!

Yes nat.gas burns clean but I think this unit had not been cleaned since it's conversion in 1985. I like to open things up and see what's there, oh and this has caused me problems before, you know if it works don't touch, but....

Guy_6

winkler

One of the first burners that I swapped out was a Winkler. I thought that the burner was nailed to the floor, it was so heavy! Here I am, tough guy at 20 years old straddling this block of iron, waddling it out of the basement.
I wish that I had saved it for posterity sake.

Steamhead (in transit)

I have

two of them. Yes, they're great for weight-lifting. They were also one of the best-designed, most-efficient burners ever made. Unfortunately they were very expensive in an era when fuel was cheap and no one cared about efficiency.

I bet if someone came out with a burner using that fuel-air handling system, a 3450-RPM motor and a flame-retention head, it would outperform anything currently available.

Rich, is this a steam or hot-water system? If steam, you will want to hold onto that Winkler until the soon-to-be-released Burnham Mega-Steam boiler comes out. It is said to be noticeably more efficient than anything currently available. But I'm not sure if Burnham will certify it with a gas burner though......

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Rich_34

Hot water

Steamhead (in transit)

You have many choices then

I'd start preparing to replace the Winkler now. Start with a full, computerized heat-loss calculation of your house. If you're not familiar with this, click on "Heat Loss Calcs" on the lower orange bar at the top of the page. Follow the instructions to get a free program from Slant/Fin that will run on a Windows computer. When you do the calc, I bet you find the Winkler is oversized.

This way, you will know the size boiler you need and can research what is available in your area.

If you're going to stay with gas, try to avoid atmospheric boilers. Their wide-open bottoms let them radiate much heat into the floor (ever wonder why you can't install them on combustible floors?) and let a lot of air draft thru them on the off-cycle (stack dampers help here though).

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