Click here to Find a Contractor in your area.
Welcome! Here are the website rules, as well as some tips for using this forum.
Need to contact us? Visit https://heatinghelp.com/contact-us/.

Installing a new steam boiler

Drew S.
Drew S. Member Posts: 17
After measuring each radiator height, number of tubes, and sections I come up with 370.3 Square Feet of Equivalent Direct Radiation. My Peerless Boiler rep provided me a chart with the radiators rating in Square Feet EDR.

Should I use the standard piping pick up factor of 1.33? Not sure where to go from here.

Comments

  • Drew S.
    Drew S. Member Posts: 17
    Replacing a steam boiler

    I am looking to replace my steam boiler and live in Connecticut. My home has a one pipe steam system and the old Burnham boiler is about 50 years old.
    The system over the past couple of years has had an unquenchable thurst for oil, so I decided to take the leap due to the high home heating oil costs.

    I have prices from both my oil company and a plumber, but wanted to know if there are any references to experienced steam heating contractors in CT? There is a $1000 difference in the pricing and each indicated they would provide a different size boiler Peerless boiler. EC-03(lower output) vs ECT 04 (higher output). Any thoughts on the Peerless products?

    One last question (open to opinions), what are the best radiator air vents on the market? I've only seem to find the Vent-Rite variety.

    Thanks in advance for any knowledge. By the way I am reading WE GOT STEAM HEAT and it's excellent.
  • David Sutton_6
    David Sutton_6 Member Posts: 1,079
    Hello Drew

    Where abouts in Ct?
    Perless is a very good boiler,but it takes more than just a boiler to make the system complete, theres piping, venting both rads and main, and proper boiler set up. then the most important, Standing behind it!...David

    To Learn More About This Professional, Click Here to Visit Their Ad in "Find A Professional"
  • from west of Chicagoland

    One of the best thing you did was brought that book. Wondering if both contractor counted the EDR of existing radatiors? If so, boilers should come close to sizing, if they didn't, throw them out and hopfully u'll fing a real boiler pros, not just plumber or just forced air guys... Keep us posted..
  • Mitch_6
    Mitch_6 Member Posts: 549
    Did either measure the attached load

    > I am looking to replace my steam boiler and live

    > in Connecticut. My home has a one pipe steam

    > system and the old Burnham boiler is about 50

    > years old. The system over the past couple of

    > years has had an unquenchable thurst for oil, so

    > I decided to take the leap due to the high home

    > heating oil costs.

    >

    > I have prices from both my

    > oil company and a plumber, but wanted to know if

    > there are any references to experienced steam

    > heating contractors in CT? There is a $1000

    > difference in the pricing and each indicated they

    > would provide a different size boiler Peerless

    > boiler. EC-03(lower output) vs ECT 04 (higher

    > output). Any thoughts on the Peerless

    > products?

    >

    > One last question (open to

    > opinions), what are the best radiator air vents

    > on the market? I've only seem to find the

    > Vent-Rite variety.

    >

    > Thanks in advance for any

    > knowledge. By the way I am reading WE GOT STEAM

    > HEAT and it's excellent.



    > I am looking to replace my steam boiler and live

    > in Connecticut. My home has a one pipe steam

    > system and the old Burnham boiler is about 50

    > years old. The system over the past couple of

    > years has had an unquenchable thurst for oil, so

    > I decided to take the leap due to the high home

    > heating oil costs.

    >

    > I have prices from both my

    > oil company and a plumber, but wanted to know if

    > there are any references to experienced steam

    > heating contractors in CT? There is a $1000

    > difference in the pricing and each indicated they

    > would provide a different size boiler Peerless

    > boiler. EC-03(lower output) vs ECT 04 (higher

    > output). Any thoughts on the Peerless

    > products?

    >

    > One last question (open to

    > opinions), what are the best radiator air vents

    > on the market? I've only seem to find the

    > Vent-Rite variety.

    >

    > Thanks in advance for any

    > knowledge. By the way I am reading WE GOT STEAM

    > HEAT and it's excellent.



    and do you have free standing radiators or convectors. Some times the convectors need a little more interpretation.
    Also is there a crossover in size between the two boilers you may have 400 square feet of radiation and have one boiler at 415 and another at 425 but the next size down for both is in the 300s. You need to produce at least enough steam to fill the system, a little over is not bad, a little under can be a problem.

    Typically I measure attached load then add 20% for pipe and pick up since most houses now have uninsulated piping. Then I match it on a chart to a boiler.

    Not to be Jaded but as a plumber I usually do not bid against oil companies since they want to sell oil more than make money on the install. I have seen several include in the quote a two year contract, it is tough for a plumber I only make money on the install.

    To the vents, Hoffman makes a great vent but it is expensive and typically if the boiler crud's up after the install and needs to be skimmed again the vents can be blown making it expensive. Vent rite 1A work great on the radiators.

    Good luck!

    Mitch S.

    To Learn More About This Professional, Click Here to Visit Their Ad in "Find A Professional"
  • Mitch_6
    Mitch_6 Member Posts: 549
    Did either measure the attached load

    How off was the two boilers if your load is 400 one brand may be 415 and the other 425 but the next size down for both is in the 300s (square feet of radiation). I typically me sure the attached load and add 20% for pipe and pickup.

    As to price I will bet that if both companies know what they are doing the oil company will be cheaper. Not to be jaded as a plumber but the oil companies sell "oil" I have seen them shoot out lower prices than I can but include a two year oil contract since than is were they make there money.

    To the vents Hoffman main vents are great but expensive. I use vent-rite 1A on the radiators.

    Good luck!

    Mitch S.

    To Learn More About This Professional, Click Here to Visit Their Ad in "Find A Professional"
  • Drew S.
    Drew S. Member Posts: 17
    Location

    We are in Middletown, CT. No one has taken the EDR rating of the radiators and that is why I am curious if anyone knows a steam heating pro in the area. Before I commit to the new boiler I want to know I have the best installing it and the piping for it.

    The one thing I can't come to grips with on the one pipe system is the exposed pipes running up to the second floor. I 'd love to relocate them as well.

    The advise thus far has been great.
  • Drew S.
    Drew S. Member Posts: 17


    Middletown, CT.
  • Mitch_6
    Mitch_6 Member Posts: 549
    I do not relocate

    one pipe steam unless I have not choice in the matter since the layout is particular and can be unforgiving to change.

    Pipe size, pitch and bends must be properly calculated for the condensate to properly return without flashing back to steam. Doing it all in steal is a given (NO COPPER).

    Mitch S.

    To Learn More About This Professional, Click Here to Visit Their Ad in "Find A Professional"


  • I live in CT but my company doesn't go as far as Middletown. We are in the Danbury area. Unfortunately even if we did your area, the salesmen for my company are not good with steam systems. Make sure that whoever looks at your equipment actually figures out the EDR. Follow them around. Some guys have a bad habit of checking the firing rate of the old equipment and going off of that. I would definately have the vents replaced and see if they'll include that in the price. Ask to see pictures of previous steam jobs and ask for referrals. As simple as a steam system may appear, the installation is crucial. If the piping is exposed, make sure it pitches in the right direction. Old pipes tend to sag over time. They may need to be resupported. Does any of the prices include asbestos removal, if any? Make sure the pipes are insulated. Maybe the higher priced guy included insualtion? So many factors to consider. I work for an oil company, too. We sell oil. The more efficient the system, the less oil we sell. You don't want an oversized boiler. Good for oil company, not good for you.
  • Leo
    Leo Member Posts: 767
    The Peerless

    The Peerless ECT is a good steam boiler but for one company to spec a three section and the other a four section boiler of the same brand for the same job I would be very suspicious. As others have said make sure they measure the connected load (radiators and pipes) not the rooms.

    Leo
  • Drew S.
    Drew S. Member Posts: 17
    EDR

    Is the EDR something I can calculate myself with the right reference information?
  • sure can!

    If u have Dan's other book called EDR* ( every darned radiators) or I can mail u the brochere that weil mclain have which almost matched what people have in their home.... But the EDR is more details and coffee table qaunity(sp)
  • Drew S.
    Drew S. Member Posts: 17
    EDR

    Thanks. I havv started the process and Peerless has sent me some boiler sizing information so I can figure out the square foot of steam per section of raditor.

    I am still searching for any advise on a good steam heating contractor in the Middletown CT area. I can't see to find anyone who will discuss balancing one pipe steam system. I'd like to have someone walk me through the process, but no luck yet.
  • Steamhead (in transit)
    Steamhead (in transit) Member Posts: 6,688
    Unless the pipes aren't insulated

    or a lot of radiation was removed over the years, that should be fine.

    To Learn More About This Professional, Click Here to Visit Their Ad in "Find A Professional"
  • Drew S.
    Drew S. Member Posts: 17
    EDR

    > or a lot of radiation was removed over the years,

    > that should be fine.

    >

    > _A

    > HREF="http://www.heatinghelp.com/getListed.cfm?id=

    > 367&Step=30"_To Learn More About This

    > Professional, Click Here to Visit Their Ad in

    > "Find A Professional"_/A_



  • Drew S.
    Drew S. Member Posts: 17
    Total EDR

    OK. That brings me to 492.5 total EDR. Now do I compare the number to the Net steam square foot column on the manufacturers boiler ratings chart? I read earlier on this site that the size should be determined by the D.O.E. Heating Capacity. I have attached the Peerless boiler ratings.

    Any suggestions would be greatly appreicated.

    Thanks.
  • unable to open the page

    Unable to open the page on my sidekick..
    I was looking at my weil mclain specs sheet.. The net IBR inculded the 1.33 pipings factor, (normal set up, insulated, etc) would use the eg 40 bolier (gas)... You have any luck finding the boiler pros?
  • Steamhead (in transit)
    Steamhead (in transit) Member Posts: 6,688
    The 1.33 pickup factor

    is already built into the Net rating. The only reason you'd use the DOE rating is if you added a higher pickup to the existing radiation count. For the 1.33 factor just use the Net rating as it stands.

    So the EC/ECT-03 is the one to use on your system, unless you want to wait for the Burnham Mega-Steamer to make its debut.

    To Learn More About This Professional, Click Here to Visit Their Ad in "Find A Professional"
  • chuck_6
    chuck_6 Member Posts: 107
    New steamer

    Drew:

    Listen to Steamhead. We have a Weil-McLain steam boiler in our house, single pipe as well. It has worked very well and is efficient. Also, make sure you properly vent the mains and each radiator.

    Chuck
  • PETE SKINNER
    PETE SKINNER Member Posts: 4
    Steam sizing

    Drew
    I'm in Broad Brook not to far from Middletown. A little to far to do install but I would be happy to drive down and help size the boiler and offer my 40 years of experience [ to dumb to retire ] all I need is a cold beer when I get there.
    Call me at 860-623-3308
This discussion has been closed.