Revisit DIYers

Dan_15

Perry, you've hit on something that I think is of great importance for professionals to understand--"communication." It makes no difference how skilled a tradesperson you are, and how much experience you have under your belt, if you are unable to communicate your skills to the homeowner. I am a professional in a completely unrelated field and the same rule applies to me, too. With a project as complicated and personalized as a boiler replacement, a homeowner is bound to feel lost among all the variables.

By and large, the professionals who post messages on this website are the cream of the crop in this business, and are very skilled at communicating why and how their system design and trade skills are to be differentiated from others. But it is truly surprising how many of other contractors out there do not appreciate the concept of good communication. I dont mean that you have to have graduate level grammar and writing skills. I mean that in our consumer society it has become an accepted maxim that the "customer is always right"; and that sort of philosophy has been imported into pracically every facet of our lives involving consumer products, regarless of whether there is an associated component for service or skilled labor.

Homeowners dont immediately focus on the value of skilled labor. Instead it is ingrained to focus on why you are charding $6000 for a $3000 boiler that the homeowner thinks they can order online for 20% discount anyway. You need to overcome that sort of thinking by empowering the homeowner feel good about what the other $3000 is buying them. You dont need to provide a breakdown of your hourly costs--that is not necessarily a reasonable request. (Although to be fair, in most service industries it is quite common to quote an hourly rate up front). But, you should be as detailed as possible with your proposals. Tell the homeowner why they need TRV's and expansion tanks, and spirovents and gorton valves, and dropped headers, etc. Dont be afraid to get technical. Most homeonwers can take it, although I am sure there will always be some who just want to compare price as the bottom line. But its your responsibility not to let them.

I wish I had worked with one of the professionals on this website when I did my boiler replacement. I was too green, and I didnt know anything, and I got an oversized boiler for that. I didnt start reading these posts until after the job was done. I wish someone had been there to introduce me to the hydronics concepts that I needed to consider. That's the job of a true professional--communicate your trade and your value.

Rodney Summers

heatloss

Perry.

Being an engineer,on what grounds do you justify installing a 91000btu/hr boiler on a 52000btu/hr heatloss this is about twice the boiler that you need?. my opinion regardless of its modulating feature there are many very efficient American made boilers (LOchinvar.Laars Raypak etc to name a few) that would better match your load ....and very reliable if installed properly and can operate on direct venting.

Now the mega $$$$$'s that you save you can spend on insullating the envelope and prevent that precious heat energy from escaping,,,insulate insulate. insulate


Brendan

Plumdog_2

good enough

sounds like you have the situation well in hand. Please keep us informed as to the fuel savings realized and other pertinent developments.

Mike Miller

DIY

Okay, I can't stand it, I was goning to leave this one alone but I can't. What kind of fool thinks that any idiot can just go out and sweat copper ipe together and that somehow this isn't a journeyman skill. It took ten years of practice to be able to say with some small level of cofidence that I could make a solder joint on any size of pipe and I have soldered up to 4" copper and brazed up to 8" copper and the odds would good it would not leak, BUT WHY DO YOU THINK WE TEST it when we are done. and would a homeowner know how to fix the one that did leak or figure out the mechanics of why that joint went bad, and as long as I am off the hook here, lets talk about all of the joints I have fixed lately on re circ systems that were not properly reamed, or de-burred if you prefer. or the joints I have had to fix because they were put together using Swifts solder, anyone remember that crap. there was a DIY delight. just apply heat and presto you got a joint. remember half of what we do for a living is to provide a water proof hole, you think thats easy?????? MIke

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Dan_15

Im not a DIY'er with hydronics--I wont touch it. But to add to Mikie's point, I found out last night from the Wall no less that even a master plumber working on my system could not understand the importance of clean piping without using too many elbows and turns on my radiator; resulting in unacceptable pressure differential and lack of flow through the rad. DIYer will probably just be happy that he/she can connect the pipes; they are not going to catch stuff like too many elbows.

brad johns

why home owners created the system.

I can sort of see your point but, I would have to really be pressed for buisness to work with a home owner like that. If they (home owner) think that saving $800 is going to help them in the long run they are sadly mistaken, because when the new boilers gas valve takes a dump on Christmas eve (which it most certinally will) or Christmas day with a house full of people how much do you think it will cost them to pay for double time, opening the supply house, and installing the valve which will not be covered by the contractors warranty and most certinally marked up, or just tell him you will order a new one on line.