Curling rink question

Dave Brown_2

I had a guy come in and ask me about doing some hydronic radiant heating for him. It's a strange application so I think I need some advice as to whether the system will work or not. They have a curling rink with 2 exterior walls. Curling ice is kept at 30 degrees or so. During the winter when the outside temperature is very cold, the losses through the wall affect the ice along the exterior wall making the ice much colder along these walls. He wants to install radiant heating along these exterior walls to heat the walls. I am concerned that the heating will also affect the ice and start melting it. Is there any way to direct the radiant heat so it only heats the exterior wall and not the ice to? The one wall is poorly insulated while the other has been sprayed with foam insulation. Now he tells me the ice is better along the wall that they insulated, but is still not what it should be. Is he better off spending money the money to increase the wall insulation? Or will the radiant heat will help?

JimGPE_3

Depends.

If by radiant heat you mean a Co-Ray-Vac system that heats from above with a very hot gas-fired steel pipe, I don't think this will work.

If by radiant heat you mean finned tube, I think that's a great idea. Mount it as low on the wall as you can to offset the heat loss through the wall. Put the water on an outdoor reset so that the finned tube puts out more heat the colder it gets outside, and you should have solved your problem.

One consideration is physical abuse of the enclosure. You might want to get 18 gauge cover or consider a "security grade" product so that if the space is ever used for anything other than curling (say, oh I don't know, hockey, for instance) the enclosure won't look like it has been beat with a hammer.

Finned tube heats mostly by convection - hot air rising, so not much of the heat will hit the ice, especially if you keep it a couple feet above the surface.

Jeff Lawrence_24

What I know about curling

Can be put into a thimble with a lot of space left over....

Here's a thought. If I read your post correctly, you need just enough heat to offset the cold that is 'overcooling' the ice, right? To me, that reads you need just a few (literally a few) BTU's to offset the infiltration.

Just another viewpoint....

To Learn More About This Professional, Click Here to Visit Their Ad in "Find A Professional"

J.C.A._3

Curling Rink ?

Why not just extend the pipes that cool the ice surface UP the wall, insulate behind it to keep the wind at bay and have it "heated" to the same temperature that the ice is supposed to be? Random theory but maybe a cheaper solution....

If I remember, they pump a brine solution under the ice because it will flow at a temp. well below the freezing point of straight water, causing the water above to freeze. Thats got to be special tubing to handle the temps and makeup of the solution.Wouldn't it be easier to have the proper temp where you need it instead of trying to find a fineline temp, that will be subject to freezing continuously? Random thoughts...Chris

Cosmo_3

Curling rink

Wow, I would definitely pursue the wall insulation side, because getting the heating curve of the hydronic radiant to match the cooling curve of the ice rink cooling system to match will be almost impoosible when variations in outdoor weather versus indoor temps will swing independant of each other. Add to that you will not much leeway if the owner needs a constant 30degrees. Is there any way a thermal break can be cut/installed between the ice rink and the rest of the structure? Just a thought...

Cosmo Valavanis
Dependable PHC Inc

Ex Maine Doug

Curling rink ice

needs to be very uniform across the rink and along the length of the sheet. Shifts in temperature affect hardness and surface characteristics such as the grain and slickness. Before a game the ice is sprinkled with a pebbler to create little hills and valleys. The pebble like surface combined with the small travelling area of the stone allow it to travel farther. So one might get uneven pebble if the ice (sheet) had a varying temp across and down the rink.
One plays in both directions so this unevenness could influence the stone more in one direction than the other.
I would think the the radient should warm the wall to offset the outside temp but not directly influence the ice.

DIYPeter

Curling ice

Now HERE's something I know about. I maintain a curling rink in Wisconsin. We keep ice late August through most of June. I believe we're the only ones to do that. We have a well insulated 2 sheet club... steel building. We keep an ice surface temp of 26.5F. Air temp while curling..40 @ 5'. This makes for the best ice. We use a Modine heater. The single BEST improvement we made was a Bry-Air dessicant dehumififier. This suited our building. I've often thought that the compressor heat could be used, but since we are using ammonia, scavanging that heat and venting it into the building would be, shall we say, problematic. If he insists on radiant wall heating, look at using compresor cooling water. There are quite a few variables and sources of information peculiar to curling. Have him email me directly. By the way, curling will be featured on ESPN2 this Monday 4/18. Peter C.