Hey Prof - this really bugs me (GrandPAH)

Unknown

U hit it right on the spot ! I was told by a supply house guy stating that most inspectors are doing what they doing now because they can't or do the real job. They become high and almighty once they are labeled inspector, most of them are abusive in their powers. Why can't they go after the handyman's companies and hack of all trades? Unpaided leinsces plumbers are easier to follows..

Dave Yates (PAH)

Condensate drains = pet peeve

Every year we find ourselves faced with trying to explain to homeowners why their condensate drains, that were simply stuffed into a hole drilled in the concrete floor, must be properly trapped and pumped to a drain - as they should have been from day one. Peering down the vacated hole reveals one nasty snot-cicle! During winter months, the condensate from the hi-e furnaces can back up into the safety switch and cause no-heat calls. For those furnaces that don't condense, this is a great way to introduce radon into the plenum.

Why do codes not focus on this issue?

To Learn More About This Professional, Click Here to Visit Their Ad in "Find A Professional"

Plumdog_2

Codes are there

But the swap artists with the lowest bid don't care about codes, because they have no permit and hence no inspections. You and I have to play by different rules; much like we have to pay high insurance premiums because half the drivers on the road have NO insurance and NO drivers license. If the Highway Patrol turned a blind eye to the unlicensed, uninsured driver; the highways would be much like the Plumbing and Heating industry; ie only half regulated and the other half running amok!

Unknown

the codes

Some of the codes are the problem! The codes required floor drain in mechical room which I agree but why in the MIDDLE of the room? Where the conds drain and humidfier drain laying across the floor and becomes a TRIPPING hazard... So the homeowers and handyman just drilled into the concrete floor to eilimated the hazards.. I had some jobs failed the inspection due to floor drain not in the middle but offside near the furance, making it the lowest point... Nope, must be in the middle and that drain is the highest point.. But it passed...

Unknown

the codes

Some of the codes are the problem! The codes required floor drain in mechical room which I agree but why in the MIDDLE of the room? Where the conds drain and humidfier drain laying across the floor and becomes a TRIPPING hazard... So the homeowers and handyman just drilled into the concrete floor to eilimated the hazards.. I had some jobs failed the inspection due to floor drain not in the middle but offside near the furance, making it the lowest point... Nope, must be in the middle and that drain is the highest point.. But it passed...

Eugene Silberstein 3

When asked to look at a job...

Dave, this comes up so often and I can't imageine how many times I find myself on the short end of an argument when I tell a customer that the condensate removal system should be reworked.

Mind you, most of my field work is in the form of a customer/company calling me in to do consultation work for them.

Customers absolutely hate it when I tell them that the condensate removal system needs to be redone. More often than not, the response is along the lines of, "It's worked for XXX years just fine, so why are you recommending that it be changed". When I get one of those, I point to the water-damaged sheet rock and nod my head knowingly.

I feel your pain Dave. I feel your pain.

Dave Yates (GrandPAH)_1

codes!

Up until this past year when PA passed the Uninformed Code and now has issued the 17th or 18th revision, which is still wrong, the only thing that was inspected was the plumbing.

When they passed this new state-wide code, which can be ignored by communities who wish to opt-out, there was no educational provision for having inspectors at the ready! We're several thousand inspectors shy of the numbers needed and, unfortunately, most of the inspectors working for the third-party inspection agencies do not have adequate training.

Case in point: we installed a loft HVAC job. Township charged $170.00 for the permit and single inspection (said it'd be $75.00 for each re-inspection if we failed). Never asked for my Manual-J calcs and the inspector never even went into the loft to check our installation. Instead, he had us remove the panel cover and told us we'd need to wrap a piece of red or black tape around the second leg of our 220-volt (white wire) wire. Now, I don't claim to be the sharpest knife in the drawyer, but a colored piece of tape isn't going to provide safety for anyone who can't recognize the business-end of a double-pole single-throw 220-volt breaker! That was all he inspected. Far as I'm concerned, the HO got ripped off.

So, I called up the State and asked them what the heck they're doing with the $2.00 inspector education fee attached to every permit we obtain. Turns out that goes towards funding for an inspector's "college". The sad thing is this: no one in the inspection business is required to attend and if they do chose to attend, they pay to go - a disincentive that will keep them out of the classroom - except for the few who strive to improve themselves and their performance.

I offered to help the State develop an inspector's check list. A simple guideline to aid inspectors and provision to help HO's get a fair shake at getting what they're paying for. The reply: no thanks, that would be too confining. Too rigid.

Toss in the Uninformed Code's provision that grants an exemption for permits and inspections if you simply replace existing equipment with the same size and fuel. On the other hand, do your job as a pro and run the calcs and install correectly sized equipment that varies in size from original: you'll be required to obtain a permit, submit your calcs and get an inspection. Doesn't take a rocket scientist to figure out what's going to be the "standard".

To Learn More About This Professional, Click Here to Visit Their Ad in "Find A Professional"

Plumdog_2

holy crap

It sounds like your state is totally confused. Around here, (Co.) it can vary from county to county or city to city. Out in rural areas there are still places where anything goes. Some locales have privatized inspection services like you mentioned. The thing that galls me most is the lack of enforcement for those that are flying under the radar, or the Black Market Plmb and Htng Companies. Even some of the big advertisers will never pull permits or hire licensed personell unless they get busted; because it eats up too much profit. Years ago the inspectors would stop and ask to see a license and permit when they saw a service truck doing work. Now they say they are too busy to be doing "Police" work. Bull Corn. Put me on the payroll and I'll do it.

Dave Yates (PAH)

exactly

what we're seeing too. The third-party inspection agencies don't care about the trunk-slammers and the codes departments don't have the time or inclination. A large number of licensed contractors have opted-out from obtaining permits because the process is too expensive, wastes huge amounts of their time and they're sick & tired of having inspectors arrive who aren't well educated and don't know how to properly interpret the codes. Permit revenues have fallen off dramatically.

To Learn More About This Professional, Click Here to Visit Their Ad in "Find A Professional"

Plumdog_2

furthermore

I think they jollywell DO have time to do better enforcement; one of the Inspectors around here told me (in confidence) that if he was working for a private enterprise, he would expect to get laid off as slow as things have been going. All they gotta do is look in the little local papers and call some of the Do It All types that advertise Plumbing and Electrical. The inspectors have been instructed to "mind thier own business" and "don't start any battles that you can't win."

carl p.

tools

IAM TAKING HVAC AT BOCES IN PORT EWEN NY AT NIGHT.
LOOKING FOR A GOOD CATALOG/OR INTERNET TO BUY AC TOOLS.
COULD YOU HELP ME OUT?