massive gas usage .....HELP

George_10

recently, this could also add to the low efficiency of the boiler and the other componants.

The junk, scale and corrosion that collect in a system will make the boiler work harder to do the same job. This results in higher fuel bills.

What is the color of the system water and is there any sediment in the bottom of a bottle of this flush.

Check out our web site www.rhomarwater.com. Look under hydronic products for our cleaner/treatment information.

As many have mentioned, a hydronic pro would be worth having investigate what is wrong with your system.

corey_3

I have a 3500 sq ft house with a 700 sq ft cottage out back
the cottage has a new 50,00 btu furnace and new hwt, very mild usage by tenant.
The main house has a 120,000 btu boiler 84% efficiency that also feeds indirect hot water. there are two gas fireplaces that are only used maybe once a week for about 2 mnths a year.

LAST MONTH I USED 55 GJ OF GAS!!!!! and last year was 43GJ for dec.so its been a problem for awhile. I know someone with a similar house and they used 13Gj.
55 Gj cost me 780 dollars

the house is well insulated with double glazed windows and not drafty
I'm lost...... I don't smell gas leaks...... I ... I... help!

will smith_4

Corey-

What type of convectors do you have-is it radiant, baseboard,etc.? How is it controlled? Have you had the system tuned up/cleaned?

corey_3

first floor is staple up under floor with 1/4 " foam and foil backing pressed against the pipes and then insulation between the joists and finally 2" foam nailed to the bottom of the joists.
the second floor is infloor with the pipes inside 1 1/2" concrete poored on the subfloor
there are seven zones through the house whiuch are each fed by a 3/4" ?? line to the area then its split into 3 or 4 smaller lines for that zone.
the system has'nt been tuned up for awhile but thats next
question.... does cleaning etc affect the efficiency THAT much?
I estimate my gas usage is more than double what it should be?

Steve_35

Have an HVAC pro come in and service your system.

The starting point is make sure the boiler is running efficiently and safely.

Dale

gas use

Who installed the underground line to the cottage? You may want to isolate it and do a #100 pressure test overnight. I would also manually valve off the fireplaces and separate loads then test each thing one at a time clocking the meter to see if actual use looks like nameplate rating. Depending on where you live the use over a year ago varies alot. Where I am the Dec before last was warm and this past Dec cold with a large gas cost increase. Many $100 gas bills turned into $200 ones.

D lux_2

Ck the meter reading

Might have misread Or they read every other month and est. between .

Wayco Wayne_2

How often

is the boiler cycling? Frequent cycling can drive down efficiency. Just like city driving can in a car. Not a lot of info to go on. How is the house insulation. Can the gas company give you years past useage? Is this something new or perhaps a building envelope issue? Is the house warm enough? WW

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corey_3

the line has been there at least 20 years... well before me
my next test was going to be turn everything off and mark the meter then check it a couple hours later

corey_3

this has been going on for years...almost constant...this dec 55 Gj...last dec 45 Gj.
It has'nt been just one high bill they are all high... I've been trying to figure this out for quite a while.
The house is wood framed, fist floor is 2x6 , 2nd floor is 2x4 walls , attic has R40, crawlspace has 1/4" foam with foil up against heating pipes then r12 between joists then 2" foam nailed to bottom of joists.The windows are vinyl double glazed.
there are'nt any really big windows.
The 2nd floor is infloor heat with carpet on top
the 1st floor is staple up underfloor heat with some carpet and some hardwood.

corey_3

i had a gas guy look at it. he clocked the boiler at 100,000 btu's tho its a 120,000 and the boiler is getting the rite pressure at the valve.... he's scratching his head and suggested ripping it all out and putting in a furnace

S Davis

Heating costs

I just had a customer that has been paying $350.00 per month on their gas bill for the last three years, that's $4200.00 per year on a 3200 sqft 3 year old house, the boiler was set to run at 210 degrees, the installer was having problems getting heat into the radiant floor so he set the boiler as high as it would go, only problem was the presure bypass on the radiant was set so low there was just about no flow going through the radiant floor, I corrected the boiler reset curve and the presure bypass valve and it droped their heating bill by more than half,
this took all of 5 min to figure out.


S Davis

Apex Radiant Heating

corey_3

how do you set the bypass valve??and while we're at it how can i check the other settings.
I am a contractor by trade and am quite capable but have little knowledge on what each setting causes or solves.

Steamhead (in transit)

That

would be the WRONG approach!

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Tony_23

Hardware Salesman

Not a "gas guy", is what he is. "Find A Pro" who knows his stuff, it'll save you money ALL the way around.

corey_3

would an outdoor reset or a heat manager help much?

corey_3

what should the bypass valve be set to? and how do i tell if one of my zone valves might be stuck open(just trying to brainstorm a solution)

S Davis

Corey,

Thats part of the problem with quite a few systems out there, some people that are installing them do not know either, so you get systems that will work but use a lot of fuel because of improper design, installation, or settings.
It's impossible for me to tell you how to fix this issue what you need is a good hydronic guy to come out and check your system.


S Davis

Apex Radiant Heating

leo g_13

Hey guys,

just to let you know, Corey is in my area and got in touch with me. (Thanx Dan) He has a Valiant boiler and indirect. By the sounds of it, niether have been serviced for a while. Also, the mixing is done through a mix valve, no outdoor reset. He is involved with the utility company in doing energy audits on homes, so I feel that he knows what he is doing when it comes to the house envelope. Since he still has access to the in-joist staple up, I have asked him to move the reflective foil off the tubing and give it a 2" air space, and as Hot Rod always suggests, get those joists ends "wind" proof.

Since the Valiant indirect has an inspection/cleaning port, I asked him to drain the tank down and have a look at the coils as he is on well water and there may be a build up issue. He is going to be sending me some pictures of his set-up, which by the way was designed by a local company, (installed by his uncle) that has a pretty good track record for installations, but I do not think that they do service work.

After I peruse the photo's I will be in touch with him and set up an appointment and do a thorough inspection.

I'll try to keep you posted on what I find.

Leo G

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Bill Nye_2

Carpet?

Does the carpet have a pad under it? Carpet is not as radiant floor friendly as tile or hardwood. It takes a lot more energy to drive the heat through it. Do you have constant circulation or on/off with a t-stat ?

corey_3

yes there is a pad but it was chosen specifically with the infloor in mind and the system is 7 zones all thermostat controlled

corey_3

do i understand correctly... you filter the water or exchange for fresh water?I have been told that it is bad to put fresh water in because it introduces a lot of oxygen (in the water) which causes a lot of corrosion.