How do guys stay in business w/ work like this?

Big Ed

Anyone who goes through the trouble of doing a heat gain or loss calulation can relate.... These are some of the replys and reactions one accounters....


--- Mr. Jacoby your home comes in at 2 ton AC and you need 45K btu for heating .----

" How could 45K heat my house,Old Joe the plumber said we need a 150K boiler , do you know him?Hes been doing this work for a long time "

"Put in a 3 ton just to make sure."

"Then why do we have a 250K boiler now?"

"I had three other estimates and they all said 3 -3.5 tons on the ac and 150K on the heating system"

"I can't see why smaller is better with AC ? "

" I don't want to be cold or hot , put in a bigger system"



" I want 65* in here on a 98* day"

" We have 200K out put of baseboard ,shouldn't we size the boiler to what we have in baseboard, thats what Joe the plumber told me .Do you know him? "

I'am sure others here can add to this list.....

Jamie_6

What?

Well guys, do you think they read the tag off of the old oil fired forced air furnace in this house?

Even after the large addition being added to this home we only need 80,000 BTU's of heat and 4.5 tons of cooling! The system in the basement consists of two 120,000 BTU Hiel heaters and two 3 1/2 ton Hiel 10 SEER A/C units. For now we will be correcting the duct work so it can handle 5 ton of cooling, we will only allow one furnace to run, and stage the cooling.

Got to love it!

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Jamie_6

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Wayco Wayne_2

Thanks God

it happens to other people. I thought I was the only one. An exteme case was last Fall. I took out a 160,000 btuh boiler gravity system. Put in a Munchkin T50 (50,000 btu) and indirect. Customer sure was nervous. (so was I) I called her this Spring and her fuel bill was 30% of what it was the year previous. I just poke my cowboy hat back on my head and say "shucks, M'am. I'm just doin my job." It feels good. WW

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Ted_9

WW

Your funny man.

Its true though. Hard to make people see it.

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Mike Reavis_2

Yup, Did the identical thing in this past winter.

My customer never questioned the size. But sure loved the results however. She was one good cold spell away from potential CO poisoning with that old Bryant boiler.

We just built a new office/shop. I am in deep trouble with the engineer because I only installed one unit, instead of two. He wanted 6 tons of cooling. We installed one 2.5 ton heat pump to a SpacePak. Our receptionist wants us to turn up the temp. We gave her a sweater.

Mike

Mike Reavis_2

It is because they probabaly charged less than

you would have to put in less for more.

Sad but true.

Mike

Scott Kneeland

Hi Wayne,
Don't the numbers on a heat loss scare you sometimes? I have never been let down with the true numbers. Enough said


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STEVEN MARKS

Inspector for my town wants 50,000 btu's added to heat loss if boiler has an indirect or tankless coil. I will probably never put a boiler in this town less than 100,000 net again. Who's to argue he's the inspector.

Steamhead

Is that Code in your area?

> Inspector for my town wants 50,000 btu's added to

> heat loss if boiler has an indirect or tankless

> coil. I will probably never put a boiler in this

> town less than 100,000 net again. Who's to argue

> he's the inspector.

Steamhead

Is that Code in your area?

I doubt if it is- maybe you need to talk to his supervisor.

Troy_3

Here\"s one

I got three other bids to staple up tube. No one else said we need plates. They said I only need a zone valve and tube. You are just trying to rip me off. I just lost a snowmelt job because of such discrepancies. My bid had a 600mbh boiler the 2nd guy had a 150mbh and the third told mr homeowner a boiler isn't needed- he just pumps water from a retention pond. The owner was so confused he said forget it. "If your industry can't figure out how this works they shouldn't fake it." I agree! Stick to what You know or get help.

STEVEN MARKS

Not any code I ever heard of but thats what he wants. He is also demanding ball valves for the supply and return of every zone as well as main supply and return. Not just any valves but ball valves. I work part time for a local oil company doing some of his installs, increasing size of boiler only puts more money in his pockett.

Mike T., Swampeast MO

And Here I Thought....

...that oversizing a boiler for a reasonable DHW load was an absolute no-no. At least one manufacturer says that the indirect should be served by the "reserve capacity" of the boiler and that if you have to oversize to meet your expected DHW demand that a stand-alone will be more fuel efficient.

As long as you've incorporated DHW priority and used an indirect of sufficient volume, there honestly can't be much problem. If the occupants have set the t-stat WAY back in VERY cold weather and expect the place to warm rapidly while three or four showers are taken, they are being unreasonable.

billygoat22

I've read that most frnaces are slao oversized. I converted my oil thermopride to a gas burner, and downsized the nozzle due to noise problems. When it got down to 20 degrees out it still cycled on and off. That's as far as I can tweek it without condensation problems.

I also downsized the a/c 1/2 ton to a two ton. Load calls for 27000-28000 range and the a/c still maintains 78 at 98 degrees outside, and 45% rh when it was 70% outside.