Panel radiators

Ted_9

Thanks Heatmeister. This is an interesting link. I dont understand 99% of the words, but the pics and installation manuals are cool.

http://www.rettigheating.com/index2_Products_Panel_Radiators.html


PATRIOT HEATING & COOLING, INC.

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RoosterBoy

hay guys im still tied up and cant decide weather to put in panel radiators or baseboard I have a complete buderus system with 2107 control. but I want to use a system that will use the least amount of oil.

here are my questions

can panel radiators still work ok if I have desk's in front of them. or a sofa in front of them.

also what use's less of a water temperature to heat
baseboard or panel rad?

and will baseboard and panel radiators work well together in the same house.

half of my house right now is on baseboard.
this side of the house is the side im still debating
and I use this side more often so I want the best.

here is what I am thinking tell me if im right.

all the rooms on this side are small the living room is filled with 2 sofas and a 65 inch screen TV and a Vermont casting wood stove so putting a rad behind a sofa may not be the best thing. right?

now my office has 2 (L)shaped desks so maybe putting a radiator in front of them may not be good ether right?

my bedroom is fine I have a nice window spot I can put
a nice 36x36 rad in front of

and the bathroom is ok I can put a nice 24x24 rad in there no problem.

so I am thinking since I have rooms that are crammed baseboard may work better for me and this way my 2107 will work well with a bf indoor sensor.

money is not the problem here and I can install ether system I just cant do infloor heating my floor joist are 2x8 I don't want to put holes and run all that tubing and plates to much work for me

so guys what would you do in my case. remember I want the best and the most efficient system that will work best in my case

thanks

Mike T., Swampeast MO

can panel radiators still work ok if I have desk's in front of them. or a sofa in front of them

It's best to keep them exposed so they can radiate well, but they will still heat by convection if not in the open. If you suspect they'll be blocked from view, I'd suggest the convection enhanced models with vertical passageways through the center.

also what use's less of a water temperature to heat baseboard or panel rad

It all depends on how they are sized. Within practical limits both can work with very hot or relatively cool water.

and will baseboard and panel radiators work well together in the same house

Yes. Would though suggest keeping them on different zones as their heating characteristics are different.

Again, best if they're in full view of the space. But not always possible--don't forget the convection enhanced models. Personally I wouldn't put a panel on a wall in front of a desk. In cold weather when they may be quite hot, the radiation could be overwhelming.

If you're a woman who wears a skirt or a traditionally clad Scotsman, you might appreciate a small panel on the wall under the desk :0

Big Ed

More good points

Panal radiators are easy to clean..

Put them under windows if possible to create a heat curtin ..

Panal rads are easy to install.

Most panal rads produce convection and radiant heat.

You can pack a lot more btus with less wall space then you can will bb.Which is a plus comming of the set back on cold days withe the 2107....

I like the looks of the panal radiators

You get built in miro balance adjustment with the Buderus rads

Since price is not a problem go panals....

Mad Dog_2

For all the aforementioned reasons...Roosterboy

I would do panels too..Another thing to add, they will stand up over time better than standard baseboard - more durable. Last reason: You are in the business...anyone can slap up baseboard....You can show friends and family and potential clients that you think 21st century! Hey, how'd you get the nick name Roosterboy? Mad Dog

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RoosterBoy

mad dog thanks for the info true any moron can put in baseboard and id love to do panel rads but I think with the desk and the my sofa in front of the windows that my walls dont have enough space to put in panel rads i can do it in the kitchen bathroom and one bedroom but the rest of the house will have to go baseboard.

maddog I have seen your house and steam setup on hvactv nice job mad dog and you do fine work it's a pleasure to speak with you and I aprecheat your help.

thanks

vhlaundry

Small Details

I have too been researching this type of approach. I like the panels as well. Now it comes down to which brands. Go to this website: http://www.rettigheating.com/index2_Products_Panel_Radiators.html

Rettig looks to be the biggest manufacturer,Purmo, Dianorm, Myson, Radson, Vogel and Noot and Rak. However note that there are slight feature differences within their brands. The Radson can be connected from behind the panel. This is a nice touch if you don't want exposed connections. I am no expert but think you could only use this application on an inside wall???

RoosterBoy

thanks but i am going to use buderus
http://www.buderus.net

Mark Eatherton1

Why not the ceiling...

Hang a nice panel radiator on the ceiling above the window.

Unused space, relatively easy access, works like a CHAMP.

Why's everyone looking down? Look up! AND, you can paint it any color you want, so long as it's not metallic (copper, silver, gold).

A little known fact about radiant ceilings is that they have ZERO contribution to the convective currents in a given space. In other woords, their output is 100% radiant.

It IS less than what the same surface mounted low and horizontally would be DUE to convection, but it's 100% radiant, which is a better means of distribution and it is more than adequate if controlled with a non electric TRV.

Proportional output. Perfectly balanced comfort.

Look up, look around. THere are PLENTLY of easily installed flat panel radiators.

Heres one I made in my back yard as an experiment. Pre-hydronicized sheet rock...

Now, if I can get these panels with those little microencapsulated wax pellets in it, and charge it with solar so it lasts forever, and back it up with a 98% efficient driving force, I'd bet I can get a GO from the Green Built/LEED people. Or, I could get them DHW system that is 3 or 4 hundred percent (300% to 400%).

Or maybe I could couple it with a hydrogen fuel cell and use the electricity to power a heat pump that's recovering the waste heat recovery, keeping the cell cool, which is a known reason for wanting to figure out how to do it...(cool cell temperature).

NAH!!! It can't be done:-(

Dale won't let me...

Habby Friday as the Weezerd would say!

ME

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S Ebels

Inside-Outside

Upside-Downside. We put rads on outside walls with absolutely no problems whatsoever and feed 'em from the back. Think constant circulation and your outside wall concerns will disappear. As far a brand goes, I like the Radson line, especially with the new bracket system that allows the brackest to be placed anywhere on the back or the radiator. You can also reverse the whole rad to enable you to feed it from the right or left end. Just remember that the return is always the outer pipe or the TRV's will hammer like crazy when they start to close.

S Davis

Vertical Panels

RoosterBoy,

Why not go with vertical panel rads, you don't need as much space?



S Davis

Apex Radiant Heating

vhlaundry

Pex behind rock

How would it work if (and this is a big if) you were kinda remodeling. Tear out your sheet rock on walls insulate behind then run pex on horizontal on wall say 4 feet up? Can you generate enough BTU's through Sheet rock without aluminum as a conduit. That way you are totally hidden just like under floor?

Mark Eatherton1

Yes, butt...

and you know there's a butt in every crowd...

It would require a substantially higher fluid temperature to deliver the goods. The plates are worth it. Here's proof.

I actually tested bare PEX, bare aluminum, copper fin tube, painted and unpainted in walls, and lastly, pex in aluminum heat transfer plate. The plates won hands down.

You could easily get 50 btu/sq foot/hr out of a good wall design. Possibly more depending upon your AUST, wall colors etc.

ME

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RoosterBoy

wow that is the coolest idea I have ever seen guess what? im the right person for that type of install I have all new exposed stud walls in my house ready for insulation and sheetrock I could do that but im scared that it wont heat the house and id be out some $$$ what do you think should I go for it :-)I have baseboard on the other side of my house so id need a mixing block and I new module for the 2107 control something to think about I just hope it works for me :-)

thanks for the info guys

jerry scharf_3

I just did this

RoosterBoy,

I just went though this and figured out a nice way to do it. My setup is for inside walls. Outside walls need much more care or you lose a bunch of heat to the outside. Use it if you like it.

Buy the radiant engineering thinfin U transfer plates. Get a dado blade for your table saw. Set the dado wide and deep enough to fit the tubing part of the plate in comfortably. Cut 2x3 stock to fit between the studs, clamp together a bunch of pieces and put 2 dado cuts in each cross piece. Fit two or three pieces to a given stud bay, set them on the floor, cut the thinfin to fit nicely, nail/staple the unit together on the floor. Nail the unit into the stud bay. Use a piece of scrap across the front of the studs to set the depth exactly for each cross member. Plumb it with pex using the standard 2 pass stud bay setup (don't forget the nail protectors where the pex goes through the studs.) Stuff insulation behind it to direct the heat the way you want it to go. then sheetrock as usual...

I'm not planning for the output levels ME is talking about, but it's a great way to heat in places you can't otherwise.

jerry

vhlaundry

Now that is what I'm talking about

Very cool. Will you be at Wetstock?

Weezbo

Mentioned pannels i did...*~/:)...

Weezbo going Yoda on you