What to Ask For When Selecting a Service Company

Rocky

We brush and vac EVERY boiler flue, EVERY time we service it. Pull every chimney and vacuum top of sections and clean-out chimney connector and install a draw band for future ease of removal. We change nozzle and oil filter every time. We pull expansion tank off systema and check air charge. We trip pop-off on boiler and water heater and make sure it resets before we leave. This way we can check to see if boiler feed is working as well by replenishing the boiler system. We clean and reline firebox every two years and take a stiff wire welding brush to inside of firebox to remove scale and soot brushing of the flues won't touch. We check all zone valves, protecta-relays, cad cell readings, and fuel pump pressure. We pull all burner motors and check the fan blade for lint or crud buildup and scrape them down if possible. We check the fuel pump coupler at this time. We also reach in and grab the fuel pump shaft and give it a good pull at this time. Amazing how many times it will come right out in your hand. Just friction keeping it pumping oil as the shear pin has sheared. WE check and adjust the electrodes and we check the transformer or ignitor strength. We wipe down the inside of the burner housing to remove accumulated oil and dirt/lint/fuzz. We check the operating aquastat for temperature shut off settings, and of course combustion test the system after all the above has been done. We wipe off the boiler with some Simple Green, vacuum up our work area, and remove our trash. Each tech is allotted two hours to accomplish this and we charge $200. WE have more customers than we can service and do not accept new ones. People are literally beating a path to our door to get on our customer list. Do a GREAT job, at a price commensurate with the quality, and there will always be a certain segment of the customer base who will GLADLY pay this price for the quality of the work. We don't want, nor do we take, price-shopping customers. Don't be scared of offending a potential customer with your price. To paraphrase Larry Steinmetz's seminar at the 2003 Wirsbo HCT gathering, It gives you a chance to tell them why you are more expensive by twice than the guy down the street. We lay out EVERYTHING we do on an annual service call so that the customer is comparing apples to apples. You won't get them all, but you will get enough to prosper.
Warm regards from chilly (currently -48 and going to -52 tonight) Fairbanks,
Rocky

Constantin

A recent thread inspired me...

... and I wonder if the Wall community can come together once more with suggestions for homeowners regarding getting their annual service done. What in your mind should we (the homeowners) inquire about to screen potential service companies? Furthermore, what are the things you do at minimum to service oil or gas-fired systems when you work on them?

I am thinking along the lines of:

• Change, inspect oil filters (if applicable)
  
• Open boiler to clean as needed
  
• Inspect flue pipe, clean as needed.
  
• Set up combustion using combustion analyzer
  
• Test the safety devices
  
• Etc.

joel_19

well...

sure that's all great and all we do that and more for our regular clients but when people call out of the blue the first thing they ask is " How much" We say our regular rate , they say something like "Are you serious? That's 3XS what our oil company wants and we thought they where too much " then we here a dial tone . Of course at best the oil company will change filter and nozzle , some don't even do nozzle. Nobody opens them up untill they plug . But stupid home owner is happy because he had to only pay 59$.
To many of these folks who don't get it we are rip off artists when we want to do it correctly , sad but true.

J.C.A._3

Constantin,

#1 You posted at 4:05 in the blessed A.M. ...Get some sleep!

#B, YOU know the questions you need to ask the potential service providers and also know your boiler as well or better than most.


#3 Ask the supplier of the boiler for the company they sold the most of your set-up to in the area. You might ask the supplier about their quality of service related requests also.(did they call asking questions that are answered by reading the directions, or were they used for knee comfort?)


Part-4 Do they TEST?

If you find the right combination of these, hire and use them! If someone skips a step, they may be doing it for a reason....they've seen this before and know that they don't have to worry about it because....
Like most things in life, common sense will be the answer. However, we all know that common sense ain't so common. I believe the Romans said it best. Caviate Emptor/buyer beware!. Good luck and I wish I was a bit closer. I'd like to see the system up close and personal. Chris

lchmb

Not all

I understand what your saying Joel but disagree with you in some case's. I work for an oil company and the tech's I work with strive to do the best job possible. Not all "oil companies" are the same, as you will find all "service companies" are not the same.

Constantin, not only should you ask the obvious, but I would ask if they test all safeties. Do they inspect for proper installation, do they check the tank for any issues. Will they warranty their work. Can you expect a clean site when they are done. Do they mind if you watch?

If you have a boiler, ask if they test the pressure relief valve, do they check the pressure in the expansion tank, do they check for sign's of leakage. Will they repair any issue's (if found) or will you need to hire in someone else.

A furnace, do they check the heat exchanger? Will they test it. Do they replace the belt (if needed) on the blower. Will they clean the blower assembly.

And of course the big one in my mind, will they be available 7 days a week 24 hour's a day? Even with the best inspection and cleaning thing's break. Generally on a Saturday night at 2 a.m.

There are a lot more thing's I could come up with off the top of my head, but it never hurt's to see what you will get when you ask someone to do work in your home or to maintain your system....

Constantin

He he he...

Hi Chris, nice to see you online! I'm still recovering from a long journey and 10:30 hours of time differential... and since I do not rely on sleeping pills or other such aids, perhaps that explains my early-morning wake-up calls. Just don't ask me to be functional after 7PM! Overall, waking up early and going to bed early still is preferable to going the other way around (i.e. I am functional at work!).

I am happy with my boiler installer and will use them for service, I simply posed the question for the benefit of homeowners who lack confidence in their current boiler service team and want to know what to look for. Many Wall participants have uncovered some great doozies in the past...

The point that Joel raised about price-shopping is a very good one, and I hadn't considered that contractors get a lot of tire-kickers that are spoiled by the oil industry's curious penchant for "value-pricing" boiler service calls. I hope that more homeowners will realize the benefit of proper servicing before their heating appliances die an untimely and unnecessary death.

Brian (Tankless)

Yeah, everything Chris said

I wouldn't want to be your service guy, you know more about it than I do, and have probably serviced it twice already yourself

Show me your system & I'll show you mine. This is an obscure self-contained radiant unit, made long ago by a company called Martin. I'll dig out a pic.

Brian, in steamy swampland. 72* in the house right now, with all doors & windows open.

Edit: The lady asked if I could make it "smoke less", and how much would it cost to service it? Priceless.

Ragu

Oh, Constantin...

You really opened up a good one this time. Annual maintenance ("cleaning") is seldom the most glamorous part of the job. What has made it better for me is to look at it as an opportunity (a stretch, I know!) to perform preventative and also predictive maintenance to the unit.

Since it is a scheduled maintenance call during regular business hours, I really try to test all of the components in the system (pump pressure, motor amp draw, ignitor voltage etc.) to avoid the late night emergencies. If there is glycol, test for concentration, pH etc. Definitely do the efficiency test and tweak the unit until it is running as well as is possible. Probably the biggest thing is to document and post at the unit all that was done, all the settings etc. It sure helps the next guy.

Constantin

Jet Lag is Wonderful...

... and inspirational friends are even better. So you want to see the inside of my Vitola? Are you ready for the truth? Can you handle the truth? :-P

However, first off, many thanks for the great posts to date. Like Rocky, I believe that there is a customer segment that appreciates great service and is willing to pay for it also. Putting all the things you do in a list is a great suggestion for customers to use as a yardstick... sending tire-kickers on their way is also good business, IMO.

Anyway, seeing that I'd taken the requisite service course, I felt somewhat qualified to open Ms. Vitola up to see how she was doing on the inside. Since there are only 4 bolts and a disconnect in the way, that was easy enough. Oh, and I turned the boiler off too.

So here is what greeted me when I opened her up. Note the minute accumulation of soot in the front. Very little was stuck in the back, suggesting it gets blown out. I also noted some sulfur deposits along the length of the cast iron ribs and in a ring around the front. I'll have to inquire and see when she was last cleaned to get a gauge on how much she is accumulating.

The two additional pictures show the end of the boiler and the thermal sensor that hangs into the flue pipe like a Uvula.

Constantin

Cleaning the target was interesting...

...note the interesting rust pattern and the sulfur deposits twards the rear. I scraped everything off as best as I could, though a Pro with a wire-brush would do a much better job than I...

Now that I have switched to B5, the sulfur deposits should take a hiatus. The bottom picture shows the backside of the target with the drill-out holes in case your flue gas temps are too low. Some sooting is evident here also.

Constantin

... and now for the puzzling part...

... I am not sure whether the look of the burner and the cone is normal. A fine layer of soot covers the thing, along with some Schmutz around the edges of the nozzle. Of further interest are the red deposits near the door seals and on the underside of the cone.

Any opinions on either?

I cleaned the soot, sulfur, and some rust out of the boiler chamber with the FREE™ brush that Viessmann ships along with boiler. Now the thing is pretty spotless on the inside. I didn't touch the burner, and will review the results of the commissioning/servicing of the unit with the installer in the coming days. I will want to see if a electronic combustion analyzer was used to set the boiler and the draft, for example.

Speaking of which, how many of you document your boilers before and after service to see how the unit is behaving over time? Could be a useful tool for trends analysis, I suppose.

ed wallace

choosing heating company

you could always go with an independant contractor for servicing your boiler nothing says you have to use the oil co for servicing

To Learn More About This Professional, Click Here to Visit Their Ad in "Find A Professional"

Glen

first thoughts -

are that your burner/boiler setup is darn close to perfect and without measuring/testing all your reference points - I would not even offer a suggestion for adjustment/improvement. The vitola/hansa or vitola/chassis burner are my favourite heating platforms - and are so very adjustable that near perfect combustion and efficiency is available to the very fortunate folks that buy them. It's like buying a great wine! I have one client with a BEA 58 - it's a wonderful test platform to check boiler response to various nozzle/pressure combinations & while the service manuals offer great info - I have found that there is a great deal of latitude - performance being equal with a number of nozzle/pressure combinations.

Brian (Tankless)

I like yours

better than the one I posted :O)

Is this your first season with the Vitola? And how much oil have you burnt so far, that has kept the chamber in what seems to be great shape (who said oil was dirty?).

I take it that the Vitola is a horizontal boiler with a rear flue exit. How long is that chamber from front to back, it looks to be about 24" ?.

The efficient transfer of heat fascinates me more every day. I'm just getting my daily "fix" now, then must get out onto the carport & fix my lawn mower. Honestly, the grass is already growing, and it's still January ????

Take care out there, Y'all.

Brian, in sub-tropical Swampland.

Constantin

Hi Brian,

This is season #2 with Ms. Vitola, she survived a number of unhappy events, such as chugging away while construction was going on. Allegedly, she was cleaned after the sheetrocking was over (ugghh!) but I'm going to double-check the fans and all that to make sure they're free of dust.

I'll have to dig through all my records to see how much oil we have consumed, but I'll bet it's more than 1500 gallons. That's a guess based on the frequent deliveries that open windows and other niceties mandated in the depths of last winter. This winter we've gone through maybe 400 gallons, probably less.

You are correct, the Vitola is a horizontal boiler. It shoots into a Stainless target (that has some refractory for protection), then loops back to the front, then loops past all the fins out the rear. This arrangement (along with the hinged door) makes cleaning the boiler super easy.

The chamber is about 30" long and runs the length of the boiler. If you're interested, the Vitola Technical Data Manual has a nice cut-away view of the boiler that also can be seen on this page in color.

Like I said earlier, I'll have to find out when the boiler was last cleaned before I start jumping up and down for joy. However, I agree that they can burn clean if they're set up properly in the first place.

burnerman_2

service co

one thing i think is good have a co. with at least 3 techs i went out to tune up a furn. a week ago it had been cleaned by anotherservice co. for 12 years the clean out doors still had the insulation from the factory i broke off both brackets chimey was all but plugged had another tech from our co. been cleaning he would have been in trouble