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Munchkin

Dof3
Dof3 Member Posts: 120
I have used Erie controls on all of them with great success. I just wanted to be sure I was getting high fire on my DHW tank when I need it.

Comments

  • Dof3
    Dof3 Member Posts: 120
    Munchkin with DHW

    I installed a T80 wall hanger and I was wondering if it can go into high fire without the Vision controls for heating the DHW. I have a control on it now that has 3 zones with a priority.Thanks as always for the help!
  • Paul Rohrs
    Paul Rohrs Member Posts: 357
    Yes

    But it slowly ramps up to high fire. Without the vision control, it takes 6 minutes. If you have an adjustable differential aquastat, I would dial the differential to between 5 & 10 depending on how much storage you have and what your domestic water needs are.

    Regards,

    PR


    Biggerstaffradiantsolutions.com

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  • none_2
    none_2 Member Posts: 15
    Vision I

    I would do yourself a favor and install the Vision I. One of the benefits to high efficency boilers is how they are piped and controled. You should use the outdoor reset as well. That control is not the expensive and relativley easy to set up.
  • Dof3
    Dof3 Member Posts: 120


    Can I use the Vision 1 with my controls or does it operate the zones for me? I have got about 12 Munchkins in the field and I have yet to use a Vision control. I have a hard enough time getting the boilers them selves. Thanks again!!
  • Dof3
    Dof3 Member Posts: 120
    Aquastat

    I have an aquastat on it [60gal SSU] but, it is a temperature dial I am not sure what you mean by 5&10?
  • Correction...

    If you have the V-1 conrols on board, when the control receives a call for DHW, it ramps up to 110, 000 btuH input. On a call for space heat only, it is limited to 80K btuH input. The V-1 has two leads for call for heat, one for space heat, and this is where you'd wire your end switches into, and the other is the DHW sensor, which can be digital or analog. Digital works much better FWIW.

    ME
  • Rock2
    Rock2 Member Posts: 7
    be careful

    John you have 12 Munchkins installed, any problems? I would suggest reading more about the vision control before you spend the extra dollars on it, you may be better off with Taco or Tekmar controlling. Rock
  • Jim Cheung
    Jim Cheung Member Posts: 6


    > If you have the V-1 conrols on board, when the

    > control receives a call for DHW, it ramps up to

    > 110, 000 btuH input. On a call for space heat

    > only, it is limited to 80K btuH input. The V-1


    I know this is true but I have never understood it. If the Munchkin is capable of doing 110KBTU, why doesn't it do that for space heat as well? Or maybe it does do 100KBTU when it gets really cold, but it's an undocumented feature?
  • Mark Hunt
    Mark Hunt Member Posts: 4,909
    As others have stated


    the Vision 1 has a seperate connection for your domestic water production. It automatically prioritizes the domestic.

    The way you are setting things up now, the boiler thinks that it is operating as a space heating boiler ONLY and will act as such. It will start off at the lower end of it's firing capacity and then gradually ramp up. This COULD cause recovery issues. The Vision 1 control will enable tha domestic pump and shut down the primary pump and immediately go to full fire. It also allows yo to reset the boiler according to OD temp. A Tekmar or Taco control will only reset the system water temp, NOT the boiler.

    It's worth the money, but I would suggest you get some training on the Vision before you start using them. Not very complicated once you get up to speed with the unit.

    Hope this helps.

    Mark H

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  • Dof3
    Dof3 Member Posts: 120
    Thanks

    It is all very useful information. Thanks all for your help. I am having a hard time getting any info on training in my area. My supplier has a hard time getting the Munchkin boilers and I have to go to a supplier I don't normally use. Neither has said anything about training. Somehow or another my supplier got into a pissing match with Munchkin and now can't get them for me. I might look into the Buderous.
  • jerry scharf_3
    jerry scharf_3 Member Posts: 419
    a few comments

    you had a few questions that I think I can answer:

    can you get it to high fire right away for using a zone for DHW? Yes, there is a small add on box (often referred to as the tekmar interface) that has a pair of wires labeled booster. When they are shorted, the boiler jumps to high boiler fire right away.

    Why is the 80MBH unit run at 110MBH with the vision 1 in DHW mode. Conjecture: I have a couple ideas on this. With the DHW priority, there is a limit to the time it can run in this mode, compared to the boiler that could be run flat out at high fire 24/7. Also, they publish no efficiency numbers for the DHW burst mode, perhaps the efficiency drops because the ratio ofheat exchanger size to firing rate goes down. Until the rev4 board, the DHW set point was very high for fast recovery, so it would be hard to see the efficeincy. The efficiency theory could be tested, but I'm too busy to do that right now.

    Now the price of the tekmar interface vs the vision 1 may not be too much. You need to go to the vision 1 training, but you will learn enough to help you even if you never install a vision 1 in any of your munchkins. Then again installing a munchkin without some form of outdoor reset is not smart, IMO.

    yours,
    jerry


  • go to HTP's website and contact their training guy about training.

    Frankly, the training is super simple from what I've heard (I know HO's that have gone and it's no problem). They just don't want to have to answer the same simple tech calls for every Vision I they sell so they do the training.

    The vision 1 is super cheap (comparitively) and does almost anything you'd want the boiler to do. Basically, unless you need indoor feedback (a la Tekmar Teknet 4) the vision I should cover you just fine.

    I understand your difficulties, but right now you are making cakes and skipping the frosting!
  • Mike Jardee
    Mike Jardee Member Posts: 3
    I have vision

    I have a vision on my 140 and would like it not to go to high fire
    when there is a call for DHW. It seems like a lot of energy is
    wasted, the loop will get to 185 degees. It does recoery very fast, but I would give that up for more savings.
  • Jamie_5
    Jamie_5 Member Posts: 103
    Vision training for homeowners

    I e-mailed HTP about this very issue and was politely but simply told that Vision 1 training is not available to homeowners under any conditions. Since I am a homeowner with a Munchkin T50 running radiant ceiling and an indirect(installed by a professional who was located through this very site's referral/advertising section), I am interested in what the Vision 1 programming offers, especially with respect to the immediate high fire for DHW priority. I am also arrogant enough to believe I know enough of the basics to understand what I might be told.

    So, since it appears you know something I obviously don't about how to obtain this training, would you be willing to share that knowledge, i.e. how a homeowner could conceivably obtain Vision 1 training?

    Thanks in advance.


  • I'll ask my client that went what the deal was. If i forget to post about it, email me in a few days and I'll let you know what I found out.
  • Jamie_5
    Jamie_5 Member Posts: 103


    Thank you very much.
  • tom_49
    tom_49 Member Posts: 269


    mj,

    the dhw temp. setting is done through the v1. you can adjust it not to go to 185o.

    all the munchkins come "set up" w/ the vision1 controls, you just need to add the final touches. you cannot go wrong for the $$.
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