Flow Meters

Mike T., Swampeast MO

Have asked before regarding reasonably priced flow meters but wasn't too happy with either their accuracy or perceived quality of construction.

How about the other end of the spectrum?

High accuracy with datalogging ability (preferably wireless) to a PC? Anyone know of such a creature? Forget about price--I'll faint later...

Accurate measurement in the 2 gpm to 8 gpm range or so for one; 0.05 gpm to 1 gpm range for another.

Brian (Tankless)

Hi Mike

Try googling "Flow Measurement" get comfortable, you're in for a long, interesting read :O)

Have fun.

Brian.

don_52

Flow Meters and other...

Mike,

I had meant to post some links in the past, time and
events took over;

A division of Badger Meter, cheaper than others mentioned
in past threads, real "btu meters" / computers.

http://www.dataindustrial.com/

One wire sensors and weather instruments;

http://www.aagelectronica.com/

One wire compatible Java based microsystem with ethernet
and browser capability for above. (TINI400)

http://www.tstik.com/

Weather Station software compatible with above;

http://www.weather-display.com/index.php

Plug n Play Lonworks type DDC hardware for hydonic heating;

http://www.sccontrols.co.uk/

I've got tons more, if I know what your interested in I'll
scrounge up the links and post them.

Have fun, regards, db

Mike T., Swampeast MO

Am Fainting Now!

More than the boiler itself!!

Need:

1" in-line. Very low pressure drop. Up to 150°F or so. Very good accuracy (am afraid to say "high" accuracy) at low flow rates (2-7 gpm). Not just visual flow indication--MUST have remote monitoring capability.

Am afraid those specs put anything in the "more than the boiler itself" category. DRAT!!!!

don_52

PaddleWheel Type...

Mike,

Sorry didn't mean to make you faint, the only ones I
know of that are "inexpensive" like a couple hundred
bucks are the "paddlewheel" type.

Lower pd than a turbine, "gemssensors" and "gf signet"
come to mind.

Honeywell makes one for use in hydronic boilers in the EU,
don't know if it's avaliable stateside ( figure's, huh? )

You might try googleing "paddlewheel flowmeters" or sensors.

Generally can find such devices < 200$, just don't know if
they'll meet your needs.

Cheapest being pulse output ( open collector thru pull-up )
no high level electronics.

http://europe.hbc.honeywell.com/downloads/EN2R9029.PDF

Something like the above, really have to dig though.

Happy Hunting, regards, db

jerry scharf_3

Since money is no object

Mike,

Ultrasonic units are the best out there. They can connect to the system nonintrusively by clamping onto the pipe (so you could add it and move it without plumbing.) They don't have the requirement for long straight inlet and outlet runs (10-20 diameters each.) They don't have the problem when the flow goes under 10% of full scale. Since they are electronic, getting the remote capability is trivial.

So for the slow slow unit, it's the only game in town. For the fast flow unit, you would probably be looking at a 2-3x premium over a paddlewheel unit with remote sender.

Just about all the units send pusles by default, modeled after utility meters. Getting RS-232 is a good bit more expensive. I would think you would be better off getting a separate wireless RS-232 setup rather than looking for it embedded in the meter.

Someday someone will decide to undercut the market and come up with a sub$500 unit, but that hasn't happened yet. I don't see anything so hard, though the timings are measured in the nanoseconds. There was a group at CSIRO who had put together the design for a cheap ultrasonic flow meter, but it didn't get built AFAIK.

jerry

Mike T., Swampeast MO

Oh how I wish money were less of an object to me.

With good flow data I could turn this house into a true (and accurate) living laboratory. Without I'm reduced to guesswork.

Outside the R&D labs, not too many real-world spaces can change between boilers (traditional cast iron and condensing/modulating) AND change from fully proportional to simple digital (wall thermostat) control with extreme ease. Could easily show the effect of different heating curves and even compare outdoor with indoor reset.

Even the local climate is VERY well suited. Frequent periods of very rapid temp variability and frequent sustained periods of nearly constant outdoor temp. Freakish cold and freakish warm are both nearly "normal" in most given heating seasons.

Chicken or egg? Might be able to fund with the proceeds from my "might happen" book titled "Proportional Hydronic Space Heating" but the book would be EVER better with REAL data to undeniably show the benefits.

Sorry for the rant and this is NOT a plea for "sponsorship" either corporate or otherwise. Fear I'd loose my objectivity.

Mike T., Swampeast MO

db

You didn't make me faint. My own requirements did.

Mike T., Swampeast MO

Jerry:

From what I can find sub $3000 is bothering me.

Kevin McAfee

Flowmeters

I do not know what the availability is, but I do know that Rinnai instant H2O heaters have a turbine flowmeter in them. Can you purchase one of these, and rig it? I suspect that it either puts out pulses or a proportional voltage to the speed of the wheel.