No steam trap in my 1 pipe system

thfurnitureguy_4

While at the local plumbing shop getting the stuff to add more main vents to my system I discussed the poor heating characteristics of my system with the local steam man. He asked if my steam trap was good. I thought that steam traps were used on 2 pipe systems. I don't have one. Should I? I get no pressure on the gauge at the boiler and my condensation return tank has a stand pipe "T"ed into the fill tube for the tank that vents to the air. If you cover it with your hand it builds some pressure (not enough to read on the guage) The pressure cutouts are set below 2 psi (0.5) His solution was to jack up the pressure to 2 -3 psi, add vents and add a steam trap. What do you think?

Alan(CaliforniaRadiant)Forbes

No traps

are necessary on a 1-pipe steam system. Steam traps prevent steam from getting into the separate return, but there is no separate return on a 1-pipe system.

Keep the pressure low: cut in at ½ psi and cut out at 1½ psi.

His one good piece of advice is to "add vents", or more specifically, make sure the main is properly vented and that all your radiators vent properly.

The main vent size, type and quantity is a function of the size and length of your steam main.

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thfurnitureguy_4

Thanks for the words of wisdom.
I was wondering how the system can build any pressure if the end of the return vents to open air? What I mean is that my system has a condensation tank/pump back by the boiler. The return, vents to a standpipe just before it drains into the sump for the condensation pump. I never get a reading on the pressure gauge at the boiler. Even after the system has run for a while. The system is not closed how can it build any pressure
It also seams that the boiler sets below where the returns come together and It would drain back into the boiler with out a pump. the water has to rise about a foot before it will reach the cond. pump. Why the pump?

What keeps the steam from going back down the return after the main vent? Am I heating an additional 200' of return pipe in a dirt basement. The guy at the shop thought a steam trap would help stop this.
The boiler shuts off from the thermostat and never from pressure.
Could you explane cuts in and cuts out pressure I was told that both controls were a safe guard and doing the same task (one as a backup for the other)they are both set as low as they can go (0.5 psi)
One final question. I have a vacume side to my pressure gauge. Is this system suposed to pull a vacume when cooling off? If so how could it if the system vents to the air at the pump and my Hoffman #75 vents also let air in as well as out. I plan to replace with Gorton #2 asap.
Sorry for the mass of questions I am pulling my hair out over this one not much is adding up. thanks T

Paul Mitchell_2

Pump etc

Not sure why you have a pump. Maybe someone wanted more water volume to compensate for a slow return. For a one pipe system to work ...assuming all mains etc. are correct. You need very little pressure. If yours doesnt shut off on pressure but satisfies the t-stat then what is the problem ? The steam vents are open unless steam hits them and shuts them. If they dont work right then they either dont vent anything or dont stop venting. What are your heating problems?

thfurnitureguy_4

The problem: little heat to the first floor. This building has a long run between the boiler and the cold first floor (300'). The 6 apartments on four floors at the front and the 4 room office at the back (2nd floor) all heat at 68 to 72F. The 100'x 30' retail space has 2 radiators at the front by the windows and only one heats up (the 5 section radiator) The larger 14 section one heats only 3 sections before the stat has been satisfyed in the office at the back of the building. This leaves the front room at 62F. What I can not figure out is with the vent removed it still only heats 5 or 6 sections. This is after the main vent has closed. The slope of the pipes and radiators are ok. The two steam mains run the length of the building at the celing of the first floor and the steam is blown down to the radiators at the floor. The main that has the cold radiator is somewhat shorter than the one on the other side yet steam hits the main vent 5 to 6 min after the one on the other side. I just added a manifold to string 5 Gorton #2 main vents on the slow side and add a Gorton #D vent to the big radiator I hope this works. I think you are right the return was replaced last year and I think the pump was a fix before this. If it is not needed I would like to avoid replacing it again It cost $1000.00 bucks! If it drains without it could it be bypased and removed? Thanks for all the help.

EBEBRATT-Ed

Sounds like you need help from a pro on this site. Where are u located? A condensate pump with a vent usually means two pipe steam. Are you sure it is one pipe?? You may be underfired.

thfurnitureguy_2

only one pipe to the radiators

> Sounds like you need help from a pro on this

> site. Where are u located? A condensate pump with

> a vent usually means two pipe steam. Are you sure

> it is one pipe?? You may be underfired.