Found this today

EJW

I thought you guys would like this. " The bitterness of poor quality remains long after the sweetness of the price is forgotten". EJW

Uni R

That phrase has some history here yanno...

Date: August 24, 2004 10:23 PM -- clammy


The sweeten of a cheapen price is soon forgotten after the bitterness of poor quality a quote to live each job by peace clammy



Date: July 25, 2004 01:33 PM -- clammy


Please if i,m going to itemize a propasal i,ll go to the bar first and 360 for a leased jag ok but look at the driveway it's parked in 40,000 bucks in pavers and a tax bill that more then i know i'll make in 6 months with OT the ones that act like they got nothing by bargaining everything they need are the ones with all the money and they got it by making everybody go broke to service or do work for them or better yet get out of the business because of there like.Once you get a special thrid sense of noticing these type ya do what you gotta do get heat or hot water and say nothing tell them there system the best and leave one of a kind and it proabaly is and as for job price all i say is the sweeten of a cheapened price is soon forgotten after the bitterness of poor quality let the tire kickers kick those tires or contractors and sooner or later they find there level peace clammy



Date: March 09, 2004 10:13 PM -- clammy


I've been in the hvac buissiness for 20 years in the past i worked for companies that where around awhile .I learned from these old timers and what i didn't learn from them i learned by looking .Sizing your ducts and registers correctly and your equiptment right doesn't always get you the job in my area there are so many hacks and butchers it ain't funny i don't service any newer residental that i my self didn't install just to much garbage and every body talks a good game till you see there work then the excuse list or not enough money story comes out.I stopped looking at jobs with refferences and i up front ask if there shopping price if so you don't want me i tell up front that my price is going to be higher then everybodies but there will be no extra costs and no promblems and that all there work be will clean and neat no dirt and a extremme low level of dust and if there refrells they know the deal.I don't do any new a/c work besides some commerical but mostly old er residental stuff complete and retro stuff.As told to me years ago the sweeten of a cheaper price is soon forgotn after the bitterness of poor quality.You have to be as choosey about your clientes as they are of us ,in the past 2 1/2 i've raised my prices higher i lose alot of jobs to low bids but all the ones i got totally made up for the one i lost and they where done right ,as i charged more i seemed to get more work kinda weeded out those tire kickers good luck and don,t let'em grind ya down stick to your guns peace



Date: February 12, 2004 06:21 AM -- clammy


As some one told me years ago the sweeten of a cheaper price is soon forgotten after the bitterness of poor quality.This saying rings clear as always plus as my father had told me for nothing you can work any where



Date: November 06, 2003 08:52 AM -- LEAD PIPE


The bitterness of poor quality lives on long after the sweetness of low price is forgotton


Date: October 10, 2003 09:10 AM -- lead pipe


he was telling me that alum. heat exchangers have more problems because of the temp change from the return water. after we put all the cerculators on the supply and got a 0011 for the indirect water heater it worked fine. I got 2 estamates for installing the ultra and gold pluse with 6 zones, one was $2,500 and the guy I used was $1,400. (Northeast prices) I learned one thing The bitterness of poor quality lives on long after the sweetness of low price is forgoten. Any way if some one can tell me if there are problems with the heat exchanger and what to look for when this happens i would appreciate it. I dont have a digital camera so I cant post any pictures sorry and thanks for the help.



Date: August 29, 2003 08:28 AM -- clammy


i,ve used all the units mentioned and in alot of cases i,ve found rheem units to be a excellent unit there higher eff.unit 13 seer unit are quite and there air handlers with there factory drain pan are quite small making them the ideal for tight attics over the past 3 years i,ve installed mostly there split systems i,ve had no promblem with them but as stated before it,s all up to the installer the sweeten of a cheaper price is worst then the bitterness of poor quality.we lose more then 2/3 of all quotes to low bidders insist on external lined sheetmetal seperate suppl and returns to all rooms ,high media filter system instead of 1 inch filter grill and properly sized duct work ,in real life your supplies and returns should not sound like a jet take off.p.s. i,ve been in the hvac business since 84 there all good units stick with any companies higher eff units and compair what your getting don,t go for the guy that says it will only take a day and it a peice of cake and make sure your that all the work that your going to get done is done right ask your contractor for a out line of what there going to do for your money you will be living with it good luck



Date: April 14, 2003 07:49 PM -- Al Letellier


What a refreshing letter you wrote. It would be so much easier for the real pros out there if everyone took your approach. Dan preaches it all the time and a lot of us try to practice professionalism and it's nice to see that you recognize that. And I'm sure I speak for a lot of us "pros" out here. Quality never comes cheap and the sweetness of low price is forgotten long before the bitterness of poor quality. Congratulations on doing your homework and getting what sounds like a quality contractor to do your work. You won't regret it a bit.



Date: April 07, 2003 03:36 PM - clammy


even on a budgt job mount your circ. on the supply it's just a couple of fittings maybe they can do without a spriovent to save money and p.s. if the custemer is telling you how much they want to spend let someone else do it.the sweetness of a cheapened price is worst then the bitterness of poor quality.if you have to do a job cheap and below your own stanards why do it it most likly will cameback and bite you in the butt.i pas more job up over the people being cheap than i do. and the ones i made no money on and did right i never here from ,the cheap ones i did that the cust.or boss said didn't matter spent more time b.s. around to get it right.don,t sell yourself or your custmer short

S Ebels

It's just too bad

That statement is true and always will be, as long as there are people who don't .......... A: look for quality instead of price..........B: understand that they are buying the installer and his work not a collection of parts.........I could go on.


It's just too bad that 9 out of 10 customers think that saying doesn't hold true for them.


True Story from Jan 5th,2005

I had a call from a person who had asked me for a quote on a new F/A install this past summer. The job was a horizontal 80% LP furnace in a crawlspace, new construction, 900 sq ft weekend cabin, a main living/eating area, 2 bedrooms and a bathroom. The customer had the furnace already bought. From our friends on the internet. I found out through the conversation that his furnace was 100K input. (HHMMMMmmmm that's 90 btu's per sq ft.,and I'm thinking unless he has NO insulation and leaves the windows open, it might be a tad big )

I told him it was the wrong size and to return it. Yada Yada Yada I might as well told him to fly to the moon.

Anyhow, his furnace wouldn't work, "Well call your installer, I said". "I have been all day and he doesn't return my call," says Joe Blow in reply. So being a sucker for a sob story, and wanting to see the actual install, I went. I should have taken the camera.

The furnace was indeed 100K input and had a field fabricated box on the return side with a crude filter rack screwed between it and the sheet metal holding the 10" collar. The collar was for the single 10" pipe that went to a floor boot serving as the return for the whole house. On the outlet there were four 6" supplies, one for each room in the house. The high limit was fried. I told the distraught weekender that I couldn't help him.

I didn't want to be liable should anything horrid happen. I gave him the name and phone number of an attorney I know and told him to sue the installer for negligence and left.

Weezbo

it is refreshing to work with another contractor from time to

time. it is cool because when they know thier work they tend to give you fresh insights .maybe not on How to issues,maybe in the day to day solutions that they use to navigate thier work efforts through the day. basically,A professional knows enough to recognise the minor technicalities and add some good to the day.

Boiler Guy

Unfortunately

there is ALWAYS someone who can do it "better" faster and CHEAPER. Those guys already know what they're work is worth and keep wanting to prove it! Even with all of the knowledge available to everyone a lot still still only observe "the last line"! Like my Dad always said " If you can't take time to do it right, how ya going to find time to do it over"!?

clammy

i didn't know?

I've been saying that for so long that i don't realize i say it so much .I've been holding back alot lately in blasting people i mostly just keep it to myself at work i do what i can do don't want to step on anybodies toes or insult any one and in my own work for the chosen ones i pull out the stops but i always no matter what always do the job like you had to live with at your side that really makes you think of what your doing .And as always that saying is the true holder of truth look at post of the amazing boilers ,piping and control systems that gentlemen post on the wall these are the guys who set the bar that the industry should be aiming for as a standard but it's not only the hacks but it,s also some medium to larger companies who don't have any quality or training for there workers except the cheapest way is the best because it offers the largest profit and with the quickest turn around .I believe people buy comfort not boilers and piping and they except quality i think most ho can tell the difference in workmanship but some may never take that road due to getting a better deal .Thanks for the references and sorry to carry on peace Clammy