Homeowner with Oil PM questions (long)

Adam_7

Hi Folks,
I'm a homeowner here on long island, and I'm stuck in a bit of a quandry here. My heating system is a Beckett AFG fireing a Weil Mclain #68 with 2 zones and a tankless coil. It's an older home, and we've been here for 3 years now. Up until this year we had oil and a service contract from one of the big local companies. I've always been interested in boilers and their operation, so I would watch them perform the PM each year.
Our first PM, right after we moved in, consisted of a filter, basket, and nozzle swap. No test equipment was brought into the house.

A year later, our second PM, different tech. Again, filter, basket, nozzle swap. This time, the tech opened the door to check the flame color, and was immediately rocked back on his heels by the heat coming out. Only then did he take the stack off and vac out the boiler. While he had the nozzle assembly out, I noticed the electrodes were flat at the ends - I asked him about it, and he replied "they're supposed to be that way".

Last year, and a third tech. We were back to the filter, basket, and nozzle.
I had been having a problem with oil dripping out from under the burner head, and asked him about it. He said that it was due to a weak transformer, but he couldn't fix it because he had none in the truck.
About 10 minutes after he left my neighbors were on the phone complaining about the black smoke coming out of my chimney. I got them back the next day, and he re-adjusted the air dampers and did a smoke test. To this day, the burner head still has a bucket under it catching that drip.


Due to these, and a few other problems i've had with the company on the oil delivery side, I decided to dump the company this year.

Now don't get me wrong, I'm not slamming the industry and I'm not slamming you guys. I had a bad experience with one company and their techs. I realize that just like any other industry, there are guys out there who are just collecting a pay check. There are also guys out there that really care about the quality of their work. I'm guessing that any of you guys - spending your own time talking shop on this board, is in the latter group.

So that brings us to the present day. This year I decided I would do my own service on the system. I started a couple of months ago doing research. I read everything I could find on the various manufactrer's websites out there. I learned about primary controls, Z-dimensions, spray paterns, you name it.
I got, electrodes, an F0 cone, and a few other parts from Home Depot.

I even managed to borrow an old fyrite wet kit from a friend who got it as an inheritance.

Last week I went down there all set to go. I changed the filter, and she fired right back up (two pipe system). I shut of the oil valve and pulled the nozzle and electrode assembly to check the size of the nozzle installed. I needed to pick up a new nozzle, so I put everything back together and fired it. The boiler ran for 35 seconds and locked out. no flame. I pushed the red button again, and still no flame. At this point, I began to wonder if attempting to do this on my own was such a good idea. I figured I had a nice pool of oil sitting in the bottom of that combustion chamber, and I was about to see the burner do "shake rattle and roll" routine that I had read about on the various websites.
Finally it dawned on me, I had never turned the oil back on! I opened the valve, and it fired right back up like nothing had happened.
I however, needed a drink. That experience reminded me that whatever I do down here, I have to live with - and be able to sleep at night.

So, needless to say, I'm back to calling up the oil service and delivery companies, and finding out about PMs and Service contracts... .but the quandry is, who can I trust? They all say that they do a full PM, checking combustion, and replacing all necessary parts, but then again so did my old company. The "tim Allen" half of me would still like to get this done on my own, but the more sane half is saying bring in a professional.

Any suggestions would be greatly appreciated.

Weezbo

well, you probably have the ambition to do the work

the dedecation part ... hmmm.... while there are many skilled service guys among the reader participatorship here there are a few other sites that have a Lot to offer as well. Oil Tech Talk ,and some HVAC site are two kicker sites for really recent updates on various minor technicalities of new burners systems, motor speeds various other diffuglties that are designed right into some burner furnace boiler lash ups. ..Reading is big on the list,... next seeing good work and bad and flat out Knowing the difference...Good work usually seems so simple your 5 year old could have done it...belive me it just Seems that simple it also helps to pick up a bit of education ,sit in on or take some oil repair classes where they give you a chance to do it right ..while someones there to help... what you have sounds very much like wrong air band settings ...now it has Evolved to a much more recognizable set of problems,one of which may start a chimney fire that you would not have anyway to stop,yah you might be lucky and only currently have the fire box and the side walls covered with oil that might burn itself out when fired,... many people might think oh no thats an oil nozzel that is loose and leaking all over the place...or its the trans former ....what you dont know really can hurt you and others near you,oil isnt always the nice domesticated kitten in the corner...sometimes that edge of caution is all thats between you and the angels:) there is a little book you need to peruse and read carefully it has a white and orange cover i think its called the oil service technicians work book. its a handy little jasper. it has alot of dos and donts and a ladder diagram of which way to go first. find it read it and then see if you want to make a commitment to servicing burners...there is alot more to it than meets the eye.

lchmb

Adam

Just a thought, I would be willing to bet if you checked the "find a pro" link here on this site and found someone close to you, you would end up with more than a quicky cleaning. Although there is not alot to the 68 their are still things that need to be checked and done and only experience would get you set right. It sound's like the unit need's a good brushing, nozzle checked for correct sizing (and replaced), chamber checked to make sure it's still intact and in good shape and pulling the venting. Although you have a wet kit if you don't set your smoke properly you could end up with a unit locking out or have the flame impinging causing worse problems. JMHO..:)

Constantin

Been there...

... after three years of quicky cleanings, I finally had enough and hired a different company to do the oil burner cleaning in our rental. Instead of just switching the filter and trying to jimmy the air door even more open, I found a professional that blew my socks off.

The tech was by himself and when he saw the extent of the damage, he said he'd have to come back with help. I volunteered to be his apprentice for the evening, and the two of us did the whole boiler... it took three hours.

Between the 1" of soot in the flue pipes, the clogged HX, the fuzzy-wuzzy burner, there was a lot to clean. But clean we did and I learned a lot about boiler maintenance, the function of a lot of the controls on the unit, etc.

From my experience (and I've forgotten most, if not everything) this is the sort of job you want to hire a pro for. Find someone via Find a Professional that takes the time to go over your whole system, not a harried tech that has been instructed by upper management to do 7 cleanouts in one day. It won't be cheap but it will be worth it.

David_5

Rule of thumb

A good rule of thumb is if it takes a person 45 minutes to do the P/M on your system you didn't get everything you need. If a person takes 2 hours then you have a better chance of getting everything checked.

David

Constantin

...and I imagine it also depends on the boiler?

With a simple-to-clean boiler like the Vitola, PM is likely to take less time than a boiler where various parts have to be unscrewed, etc. to get at all the HX surfaces, right?

For example, a contractor here cleans our 20-year old WM EG-series gas boiler every summer for the landlord of the rental we live in right now. To do that, they have to pull the top off the boiler, insert a cleaning rod down past all the CI stubs in the HX, and hope they get all the scale, etc. Cleaning such a boiler takes a lot of time... by contrast, the Vitola (and many other boilers to be sure) offers a nice swing-out door and within a few minutes that combustion chamber will be clean.

The Vitola also offers a built-in 3-way holder for the burner assembly, making maintenance quicker and easier. Plus, if you own the Vitotronic 200 control (or 300) and install a flue gas temperature probe, you can detect sooting and automatically schedule a service call. Those, to the best of my limited knowledge as a mere homeowner, are exclusive features to the Vitola.

Then, there are other factors, such as how much horizontal pipe is required to reach the chimney, etc. The old oil boiler of ours had about 15' of single-wall pipe to play with, so there was lots of room for the soot to settle out in. The Vitola only has to overcome about 10 feet of flue pipe, of which about 5' are horizontal.

joel_19

simple

Do not use an oil company to do this. Use an independent contractor and then don't squable about the bill. Expect it to take twice as long and cost you at least twice as much. Many but not all Oil companies keep thier service costs low by padding the oil price to cover it. Knowing this many companies rush thier tech through the day. A tech that takes extra time to do it right won't get rewarded, he'll get fired for taking to long. Sad, but true. we have techs here that where chastised for only doing 5-6 cleanings a day. They come here and just about fall over when I tell them it's ok with me if they only do two!

Adam_7

Thanks everyone

Thanks for all the tips and information. I checked out the "find a professional" link, and found a couple of companies in my area. I'm going to get in contact with them, and hopefully get everything sorted out.


Thanks,
Adam

LIBOB

You hit many good points

about oil burner service. One nice thing is you have a choice. Look for a smaller company. Not as many small mom @ pops these days but i think your chances are better at getting that 2 or 3 hour job. I worked for both small and large. Service is the losing end of the biz. The big guys want productivity. The smaller guys dont want that beeper going off in the middle of the night. I'd leave setting up the burner to the pros but nothing wrong with taking that smoke pipe down and cleaning the chimney base (THE MOST IMPORTANT PART OF A "PM") Just make sure that smoke pipe is secure when your done.