Main Steam Vents?

Joe_48

Ok, I am back with some pics, trying to figure out if I need main air vents and not air vents I had installed on my steam rads. As a request from Steamhead in my previous thread, here are the pics of my piping. I have not found any air vents on the mains. Pic 1 is of the main coming out of the furnace. Pic 2 is the right elbow which extends to the back of the house and goes out through the wall. Pic 3 is of the left main. Pic 4 is of the left elbow which extends to the back of the house and goes out the left wall. From the advice of Steamhead, I looked for the vertical pipe where I should have an air vent. However, I dont have any vertical pipes other than the main coming out of the furnace. My mains continue out the wall up to the rads on my second floor. There is no "ends" on my main. I did find one mysterious pipe, which may or may not be part of the system, which comes out of the back wall on the right side. But this pipe comes out of the wall horizontally and has an elbow on the end which points upward and is open with nothing in the other end of the elbow. This mysterious pipe is pic 5. Pic 6 is an illustration of my system (black=main pipes, red=rad feeds, blue=mysterious pipe. With that said, do I need vents, other than the one I will put in place of my "Vac Huri-vent." If so, where in the heck do they go. Thanks in advance for any help.

Thad English

yow.

Joe,


I think that you are going to want to get a pro in there to correct the situation. To my not-trained-by- a-professional-eye, it looks as though you have no equalizer, and no header on that steamer, which are standard for a properly piped steam boiler. Can you post some more pictures of the area where the returns come back to the boiler? The returns are the uninsulated pipes in your pictures. Also can you post some pictures of the side of the boiler that has the low-water cutoff and pressurtrol? And also some pix of where the main goes "into the wall." Those pix will help the pros on this site give you better direction in fixing that system.

I think that you have some sort of Vapor system with dry returns. The rads don't need vents since there should be one large vent on the returns in the basement to get the air out.

Steamhead

It's definitely Vapor

probably an orifice system from what I saw in the earlier thread.

Two questions: What happens to the steam mains after they go thru the wall at the end of the basement opposite the boiler (which you have labeled as a "furnace")?

And did you locate any names on those radiator shutoff valves?

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Joe_48

It does look like it is getting to the point where I will have to call a professional in to straighten this all out. This stinks because I already paid a guy to come in, who drilled out the plugs in the rads to put those air vents in because he thought I needed them. So all that labor (and $$) seems to have went to waste. If only I would have found this site before I called him so I could have a true "Professional" come and fix the problem. Thanks so much for the help thus far and I will post more pics.

-Joe

Joe_48

Where to put air vents on a main.

After reading the posts, I went back to the basement and took more pics. I definately do not have any air vents on my mains. In pic one, there is a joint on the return that has a nipple in the end of the "T". This pipe is the return that comes from the main that comes down from the ceiling. I am hoping this is where I could put an air vent. Like I have said before, there is no end to my mains, when they come to the back of the house, they go to the rads upstairs. Does this make sense? Pic 2 is of the lower water cut-off. To the left there is a nipple on the piping which I assume comes off of the Hartford Loop? Is this a place for an air vent as well? Pic 3 is of the Main which has a big nipple placed in the end of a "T". I am hoping these pics will give someone some idea of where in the world my air vents should go on the main. Thanks in advance.

I also wanted you guys to know, I did receive the book "we got steam heat" and it is amazing how accurately Dan explained in the first few pages of the "knucklehead" that came to my house and cranked up the pressure. It was as if Dan was standing there with us while the knucklehead looked around. I just had to laugh out loud when I read these pages (and got a stange look from my wife). Who ever knew you could get a laugh out of a book about steam heat (especially after all the tears shed so far trying to get this darn thing fixed!) Thanks Dan!

Steamhead

It looks like the mains pitch upward

from the boiler to the far end of the basement, correct? This would mean it's a Counterflow setup with steam and condensate going in opposite directions through the mains. Air and condensate from the radiators would return thru the dry return. That's probably the reason for the downward-facing tee in the main near the boiler. That would have had a vertical pipe going down below the waterline and connecting into the return, serving as a drain for condensate.

You'll have to drill and tap the far ends of your steam mains for vents. I can't remember whether you posted the lengths and diameters of your steam mains- if you did, please re-post so we can tell you what main vents you need there.

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Joe_48

The mains are 2-1/2" diameter. I haven't measured them exactly but they are around 15-20 feet long. Do you need a specific length? And where to I tap the mains? (on top at the end by the elbow or closer to the boiler?) And I have 2 mains (one from the left and right of boiler), do I put air vents on both of them? (and how many on each?) With all of this said, it looks like this may be the answer to my problems. But... does it matter that I do not have steam traps on my rads? And I should take those air vents off the rads when I put them in the mains, correct? Thanks for all your patience with me steamhead

Joe_48

F&T Traps

I guess I should read before I speak. So after reading more of "We got steam heat," I understand that I have return elbow traps instead of steam traps. But now my question is, where in the world is my "F&T Trap?" As I have explained before, I do not have any devices on my mains/returns except for that "Vac-Hurivent" above the boiler (which will get a Gordon makeover). Like always, thanks again.