cold radiator

chilly

I have a problem with 1 radiator on the 2nd floor of my house. This is a 1 pipe steam system. The boiler fires and I can hear air burping out of this "cold" radiator. The burping just stops and the rest of the radiators get hot and are even hissing, but this radiator just stays cold. It's on the end of the main line and another radiator on the first floor on the same end of the main takes a while to heat up too. The pipes in the basement are all hot and the radiator on the first floor has some nasty water hammer before it starts to heat up, but the 2nd floor radiator doesn't seem to want to play.

I removed the radiator from the pipe and some water, about 1 cup was emptied. I checked the slope and put some blocks under the back legs. Still cold.

I replaced the air vent. Still cold.

I've called for help and been told it will be 2 - 3 weeks before they can get to me.

I called my oil company and they told me that the radiator was staying cold because the thermostat was making temperature or the boiler was at pressure.

I've read just about every article on this web site. I have insulated the pipes in the basement to try and reduce the hammer.

I checked the slopes on the mains and risers.

I've made sure the valves were all the way open.

I'm at the end of my rope.

Please help.

thanks

John Lasky

I feel your pain im having the exact same problem down below. I have 2 upstair radiators that are off the end of my main and no heat no matter what I do (so Far)

I installed new vents and re pitched the problem radiators but no joy NO heat, plenty of air out of vents but thats off and on.

I did try adding a mains vent in the cellar but that too did nothing but let the end of the main heat faster.

Im going to clean my system tonight and see if that does anything??

I hope we both can receive some wizdom from one of the pros here.

hope help is on the way

"John"

CG_4

COLD RAD

You should replace you're air vents with "vari-vents" They're adjustable where you would set the closest rad vent from the boiler at a minimum opening,and as you work you're way away from the boiler towards the furthest rad vent you open them more until you reach the last one which would be wide open.In your case, the upstairs rad. These vents work great for balancing out steam systems AND ARE ABOUT $20.00 each

Thad English

not a pro...

I am not a pro, just someone who is addicted to this thing called steam heat. Sometimes the last rad not getting hot can be caused by not enough venting on the mains. If the main vents are not big enough to get all that air out of the main, then the steam will just have to push it out through that last riser. And that takes time. Meanwhile, all the other rads are getting warm and the rad in the room with the thermostat is kicking out the heat, satisfying the thermostat and thus, signalling the boiler to shut down. all before those last rads get steam.

The fix is to make sure that your main vents are big enough to vent the main so that steam gets to the end in about a minute. Gorton #2s work well. I have a 'tree' of 2 of them plus a Hoffman 75 for 90' of 2.5" mains in my basement.

Hopefully Steamhead will see this post and give us his opinion, too.

chilly

cold radiator

Well, I found some things while poking around in the basement. Are the main vents supposed to be on the returns?

I've got a big pipe, 3 or 4 inches comes out of the boiler and then "T's" out and goes from 1 end of the basement to the other. At the end of this 3" pipe is a reducer to 1 1/2 or 1" and this goes back to the bottom of the boiler. I've been told I have no Hartford loop. The vents are up on 3 and 6 inch nipples at right next to the boiler before the return pipes take the plunge to the bottom of the boiler.

From all I've read this isn't right at all. Also I found that one of the vents was spitting water!

Back on the cold radiator front, I found that the cold radiator on the first floor was eventually getting hot, but spitting loads of water out the vent.

I think I need professional help (boiler and for my mental breakdown due to the boiler).

Can somebody give me some insight into this mess I've got?

thanks

chilly

cold radiator

this should have been posted further down

chilly

2 of the radiators have vari-vents and I set the as in your description.

thanks

chilly

Well, I found some things while poking around in the basement. Are the main vents supposed to be on the returns?

I've got a big pipe, 3 or 4 inches comes out of the boiler and then "T's" out and goes from 1 end of the basement to the other. At the end of this 3" pipe is a reducer to 1 1/2 or 1" and this goes back to the bottom of the boiler. I've been told I have no Hartford loop. The vents are up on 3 and 6 inch nipples at right next to the boiler before the return pipes take the plunge to the bottom of the boiler.

From all I've read this isn't right at all. Also I found that one of the vents was spitting water!

Back on the cold radiator front, I found that the cold radiator on the first floor was eventually getting hot, but spitting loads of water out the vent.

I think I need professional help (boiler and for my mental breakdown due to the boiler).

Can somebody give me some insight into this mess I've got?

thanks

John Shea

pressure

No expert, but here are my two bits:

First, you don't necessarily need a Hartford Loop. I have an old one-pipe system in my house with no Hartford Loop, however, it does have a 'drip' piped in from the header. This will act as an equalizer (I believe) eliminating the need for the Hartford Loop.

Second, it sounds like the piping to your Main vent is fine. It should be at the very end of your main, and this is close to where the condensate line is pipeed.

Third, is the radiator that's not getting hot an "addition" to the system? What I'm getting at is that if you've added radiators to your heating system, your boiler may not have the capacity to support the added volume.

Check your Pressuretrol. It should be set no higgher than 1 psi. As Dan would say, TURN IT DOWN!!! Too much pressure could easily cause all of the problems described.

Hope this helps.

PS. I've got a problem of my own posted here, PLEASE HELP!!!

chilly

pressuretrol

well here's another question I have. I don't see any box attached to the boiler that has pressure settings on it. There is a little Honeywell box that has the press this button if the boiler doesn't fire but don't press it more than once. Is that the pressuretrol? I thought it was just a reset button.

Also my vents are like right next to the boiler on the return pipe. From what I've read here I thought the vents would be on the main at the ends.

I'm so confused.

chilly

additional radiator

I did add a radiator, but that one heats up like crazy. The two that don't get hot too quickly are on the other end of the main.

John Shea

Keep in mind, with a one-pipe system, ALL (except drips or the equalizer near the boiler) the pipes are both steam and return. The air vents near the boiler is OK. As long as the vent is piped higher than the return/main it should be alright.

The honey well box with a reset sounds like a burner control. You want to look for a control (pressuretrol) piped into the boiler above the water line (near the top of the boiler). It will have a scale on it (numbers) say from 1-5 or 1-10. If you find it, set it (usually by turning a screw) to 1 psi. Should be all you need.

John Shea

I recently put an addition on my home and had a friend (heating contractor) add 4 radiators. My boiler is rated for 125,000 btus. Based on his radiant calculations (number of columns, height, etc. of all radiators) I need 150,000 btus to heat all the radiators all the way.

Needless to say, I am just getting by with my old boiler. All radiators don't get hot all the way. It's just enough to get by. I should really invest in a new one that's rated for that output.

If your boiler won't put out the btus, then all the radiators will not get hot.

Which radiator stays cold, depends on the design of the system/piping. That could be your problem.

chilly

I found my pressuretrol. It's a Detroit Lubricator Company and it was set I believe for 1.5 PSI and a differential of 3?

John Shea

3lbs. differential sounds too high.

Does it say "subtractive" on it anywhere?
If not, Try main: 1 psi, differential: 1 psi

If so, try main: 1 1/2psi, differential: 1 psi

Are you in Detroit? I am.

Let me know what happens!

chilly

pressuretrol

no not in detroit in MA. I'll give the pressuretrol settings a try.

thanks
and hope you get some advise on your problem

Jeff W_3

another possiblity

It may be that the piping to the radiator on the second floor where it's hidden in the ceiling is not pitched properly allowing condensate to return to the boiler.
Also you say that the first floor radiators (or some of them) spit water out. Is the water level in the boiler possibly too high or is the boiler surging due to excesive scum on top of the water. The if you have not skimmed the boiler you probably should.

Big Ed

Chilly

As mentioned in the top posts , saggy branches of the risers plug up with minerals .....

chilly

risers

I checked the risers in the basement and all the hangers are intact and the pipes seem pretty solid.

I'm going to try turning down the pressure and balancing the system out by adjusting the air vents.

I the path I'm on leads to even heat.

any other suggestions/ideas are welcome.

gehring_3

cold radiator

Another thing to try is to take the radiator vent completely off while you are making steam and stand by there and see if you can hear any air being expelled or what. Be ready to reinstall the vent if and when the inlet side begins to heat up but before the steam has reached the vent tapping. If that works, then the radiator may just need a really fast vent like a Gorton size "D"

If that does not work, or you cannot even hear air being expelled, then another possibility is that your supply valve to that radiator may be broken so that it may appear to be wide open, but actually the valve seat is busted off in the off position - I have seen that happen before. You can check that by disconnecting the radiator and looking/feeling down in the valve (with the system off)to see if the valve is indeed open or not.