Radiant wall panal heat?

Jamie_6

What panels do you guys prefer? Runtal, Buderus, ect.

Why do you prefer that type? Are they easy to install, fast lead, inexpensive?

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Ken_8

Jamie,

I don't like any of them!

I saw them in europe and every one had a rust stain and leaked at the riser to adapter coupling. They are ugly, intrusive and touted as having radiant properies. Of course everything radiates some heat, but to depend on the radiant aspect alone of these types of units would require many multiples in size - of what is typical. What's typical? Lots of fins to allow convection heating to be major - and radiated to be a distant second - and ensconced in a tiny (by comparison) finned tube design.

They are pricy, ugly in all apps. except "modern/contemporary" decor and not conducive to series loop configurations. Based purely on size, HWBB puts out many times more BTU per surface area/dimensional volume than these panels when missing fins and with fins are nothing more than extremely tall inefficient HWBB with lots of distracting surface area.

Other than that...

We love 'em (:-o)

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kevin coppinger_4

I have them...

in my house. Buderus panel rads that is...I think they are great! The buderus one are fairly reasonable ..as compared to the Runtal ones...Runtal is nice stuff but $$$$$. The connections are well done,I used both copper and pex types as my house was built in 1800 and had to snake tubing up walls. I think they go fine w/ my style of house...and friends like standing in front of them in the winter to warm their buns! kpc

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Kal Row

check out

http://www.mysoninc.com/Pages/Radiators/Select.html

infrared light doesnt care where it radiates from, and since these panels have a vitual resistance value of "0", they will produce infrared light as soon as you get warm water to them, and if you feed hot water to them, they will produce enough infa-red engergy to turn whatever they are pointing at into an emitter also

as for the rust stain - it's either red rust stains or green copper sulfate stains, pick one, or, go with embeded radiant or forced air -

i am waiting for someone to make panels out of pex-al-pex

Mike Kraft_2

I have.............

many many Buderus rads installed.Some on monoflow and others "homerunned" to radiant manifolds.I find the latter to be the best of "stradegies".I rough my HWBB the same way now.There is no drop as in series loop.It is a melodic hydronic balance:) less any melodies.With this configuration it is much easier to employ other stradegies such as constant flow and TRV's.

Buderus are IMO very reasonable in cost(contrary to Kens POV).Estehically speaking many people find them horrendous in appearance(again Ken's POV for an example )but this is an obvious decision left to the client.As untraditional in appearance these emitters can appear (in the US)IMO Buderus has more of a traditional look than for example Runtal.Runtal is a great looking rad and offers a much wider spectrum of flavors.These come at more of a premium however.In all the jobs I have mounted I have yet to see the rust stains that have been described in someone elses post(G,again).I am sure there are some out there but that would be the install.

As far as comfort...............what to say,it's radiant!!Not in floor but they radiate beautifully.

cheese

Larry Weingarten

homemade

Homemade is good too!

Alan(CaliforniaRadiant)Forbes

Runtal

Easy to install? Not particularly.

Fast Lead? Ditto

Inexpensive? No

With all the disadvantages of Runtal, they are still my favorite radiator. If piped and installed properly, they work extremely well and look great.


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Ken_8

Cheese,

Are those hot dogs done yet?

You make some valid points and I was unaware of Buderus being a head to head competitor to Runtal.

However, HWBB runs (even with recently spiked copper and aluminum prices included) still costs only 1.4-cents ($0.014)per BTU w/ 180° water for the materials. (divide the wholesale cost of any size unit - by its BTU output @ 180° - to get comparitive cost/pricing).

So, what does a "typical" Buderus panel rad. cost per BTU output with 180° water?

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Ken_8

I must admit,

that does look nice.

I'm just not sure I'd like it all over the room however. The output of non-finned units is about 1/2 that of conventioanl HWBB - requiring twice as much wall space. Or as an alternate, twice the height of an already taller space than HWBB.

True panel radiators (not the Runtal/Buderus variety) was what I was refering to with regard to aesthetics and leaks. I never saw any Runtal types in europe. Just the "mattress style" panel rads - that we all thought were ugly and leaked.

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hr

Nice install, Alan

I like the fitting to wall transition.

Amazing that so many consumers are not looking for the least expensive btu emitter, isn't it

hot rod

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Alan(CaliforniaRadiant)Forbes

These are finned

and exceed the output of residential BB:

Runtal RF-3 699 BTU's/ft. @ 170° water temperature

Typical BB output at the same temperature is 510 BTU's.

Yes, BB can do the job at half the price, but after the vacuum cleaner hits them a few times, the front panels and end caps fall off; looks terrible. And unless the homeowners clean house every day, the fins clog up with dust and all air movement stops.

But each has it place depending on the heating budget.

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Ken_8

How about those

Little, teeny, tiny pinholes atop the Runtals?

Ever get blocked by rising dust, lint, cat hair, spiders, or the back of a chair?

Kidding. You're right. If you get them big enough, they can not only cover an entire wall, but maybe provide a backstop for a handball court. Something HWBB could never do.

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Brian_19

panel rads

I have used Dianorm. Pretty much the same as Buderus, but I get them a little bit cheaper than the Buderus.
My customer was very happy with the look of the unit. Sometimes a 2' x 3' panel rad looks better than 12' of baseboard chopped up on every wall of a tiled bath.

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