Boiler in closet and request to manufacturers

Unknown

in a closet in the back of a garage . It was the dry base , rubber gasket HEO - don't see too many of these still running .

Unknown

My request -

We buy almost all of our boilers knockdown . The homeowner took one look at this block and thought we were giving him a used boiler . He kept saying he was not happy with this , over and over . I explained to him that this is quite typical , the sections are shipped and stored outside and any water or condensation will put surface rust on the outside . I also said that I could bring over every boiler in the shop and they would have some rust ( although not as rusty as this block ) . I was waiting for him to tell me to get it out of here , but he just shook his head and walked inside .

My request to manufacturers is to state in the installation manual that rust on the block is normal and will not affect the performance or longevity of the boiler . Having the homeowner see it in print would make my life so much easier . This situation comes up a few times a week and is not limited to the Peerless .

Unknown

In the cubby

Not the best work , but I made sure servicing the boiler will be easy .

ScottMP

As allways

Very neat, but I am really shocked your company does not use a tempering valve on the domestic coil. They are playing roulette and the odds are running out. Some one is going to get scaulded. what temperature is the water coming out of that coil ? 170 ?

It is tough trying to explain to a one time customer that all the blocks look like that.

Scott

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George_10

And people wonder why

we suggest that all new systems are cleaned and treated before being put into service. You are right, I have seen similar in other new boilers. Then you add solder flux and cutting oils and dirt and other installation junk, it just makes good servicing protocal to clean a new install. It is mandated in federal installations and routinely done in industrial installations. Why not in home installed systems?

Patchogue Phil_23

tempering

Isn't that yellow-handled ball valve, right in front of the HW coil, the tempering valve?

Firedragon_4

I agree! Can you say SCALDING,

can you say LAWSUIT!

Unknown

Well , we see

an internal coil on just about everything , theres gotta be a few hundred thousand boilers like this on Long Island alone , all with hand mixing valves , all piped this way since the boiler was installed when the house was new - 40 years plus . I haven't heard of a scalding from old equipment or new from our customers , but I will check with our service manager . I saw some pics here of a kid scolded and it was horrible . On every install we show the homeowner how to work the hand mixer , and if they want us to set it for them , we do . Believe me George , you know who I work for and who we are affiliated with . If there was a severe problem it most certainly would be changed .

Unknown

Scotty

Last time I checked the temp comes out 140 - 145 . I'm gonna look into using auto mixers , point well taken . Thanks man .

ScottMP

Ron

You know I think nothing but the best of you. In this era of litigation its serious issue. Did you read about the plumber from D.C. who put in a HWH in an Apt. and four years later was sued because a woman put her son in the sink and the baby turned on the hot water ?

That guy was found guilty. Sad story for everyone but telling the customer how it works and saying it was always that way dos'nt cut it in court.

I know you Ron and know that you care deeply about what you do. I also know you are following orders.

Scott

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Unknown

I'm talking about the outside

of the boiler , but the inside is much more critical for longevity . Hey George , I'm pushing to try your products - our conversation at Wetstock was an eye opener .

ScottMP

its short money

CYA !

Scott

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Unknown

Thanks Scott

You are right , I would never want to hurt anyone from one of my installs . This is an extremely common and accepted practice here , and believe me , if it was a problem the practice would have been discontinued decades ago . We live in an era where even if we did install an auto mixer , piped it to specs , and it failed and scalded someone , we , as well as a few other parties would be sued . We're caught in a catch-22 . We can install an auto mixer on each coil , keep it around 120 , but then come the complaints . " We had plenty of hot water before you installed the new one ! " And also the customers who ask if the new one will give them better hot water than the old , which is asked almost daily . Like I said , I'll bring up the subject to my boss and ask if he has heard of a scald from a coil in our own customer base , as well as our much bigger affiliate on L.I. When I feel adamant enough about doing things the right way , I have some leeway .

todd s

Hi Ron

It wasn't much more than twp weeks ago that I asked you about this(I didn't bring this up on the wall). I know how you feel and I see this becoming a discussion that will be kicked around for a while. Upstate we typically have hard water so its a good idea to put in boiler drains and isolation valves for future acid cleaning. Now pipe this with a properly dropped mixing valve, and flow restrictor, and you may well need another 1/2 day of piping to accomodate all this plus the challenge of keeping them out of the way of the swing door, clean out access etc. We're trying to cut the time on an average install and it seems to take longer the more you try to be considerate to all the interests(including getting home on time). Lets keep this discussion ongoing and we'll figure out something. Todd

KBP&H

Temp Valve

Use a sparco temp valve, they don't have to be dropped ( 80*- 140* max, this usually works pretty good - still have HOT water but takes a while for 140 at the faucet.. Also keeps bacteriaout of everything,, w/ Sparco's you can set the two cams under the handle to limit customer playing even nore, a cheap 15.00 dialthermo isn't a bad idea,,, Not trying to punish you , justI have a 8 , 5 , & 2 yr old,, ans a two handle (When will they make a single lever roman tib filler???) roman tub filler,, - and take the hot handle off all the time.... I got burnt when I was a kid.

oil-2-4-6-gas

.

i have my 3 year-old nephew living with us now (his mom passed away and my brother is an idiot cant take care of himself)anyway i have found many a valve switch etc.. moved or turned off --if you are doing installs like that for hot water at the very least set it and remove the handle --or pipe in a mix valve with a flow restrictor ,inform the customer that they will have more consistent hot water but at a safer temperature

ScottMP

Sparco

IS the way to go. Great valve and it is anti-scauld.

We use them all the time. Speed should not be an issuie. We are here to do proffesional installs and need to let the customer know that a quality safe installtion takes time. This is NOT your fathers boiler install.

I know its tough out there when the competitor is selling fast and cheap, but if your here on this site then strive for the best and let the customers find you.

Scott

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