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Orangeberg pipe???

anthony_7
anthony_7 Member Posts: 72
Anyone familiar with Orangeburg. I am replacing about 15 ft of it for sanity reasons. As I am pouring a slab over where it runs.

In any case after digging down. I noticed that there were sporatic holes in the pipe. Almost like they were drilled in there. Any reasons why. There are about 5 holes in a row not exactly centered.

Maybe at the time of install it was the last piece they had left. As it is the piece connected to my C.I. going into the house.

Thanks

Comments

  • Matt Undy
    Matt Undy Member Posts: 256


    Were they on the top or the bottom? The bottom of it rots out from years of having water on it while the top stays intact. Was it a piece of perforated darinage/leaching pipe inproperly used for a sewer line? I've see much worse with an acomponying signed off permit... BTW, was it truning oval yet? Is the bottom looking thinner than the rest? Is there more runing out to the street that you are not replacing? If so i highly recommend installing a cleanout just outside the building runing up to ground level so that you do not need to drag the drian cleaning equipment inside the house since the remaiining line will evnetualy start cloging and ultimately fail. There is a special Fernco to make the transistion from PVC to ornagburg, the orangeburg has a larger OD than PVC and smaller than clay. I think it was the fiting that fit cement to PVC. You can make the PVC -PVC fiting fit, but i'd be very concerned that its additional tension would accelerate the colapse of the orangeburg. Also, make sure this joint doesn't leak becuase the last thing you need is roots at this point.

    Matt
  • Robert O'Connor_7
    Robert O'Connor_7 Member Posts: 688
    Orangeberg??

    Be careful connecting to this pipe. I would connect directly to the cast iron and reconnect to the orangeburg at the curb line if possible. If you just replace a piece in the middle you will find that the inside diameters will not meet/match up thus causing a restriction to flow. Depending on your location, local codes may dictate additional cleanouts to be required, this would be a very, very good idea. If possible install a cleanout directly where you connect to the cast iron (within 5' of the structure) and another one at the curb line or where you connect to the orangeburg pipe. Another good idea is to slide the new pipe as far into the orangeburg as possible (without creating a restriction). The cast iron is generally a diameter smaller than the orangeburg allowing you to do this...Robert O'Connor/NJ
  • anthony_7
    anthony_7 Member Posts: 72
    Special Fernco ?

    Actually it seems like to be in pretty good shape still and the holes are in the top.

    Assuming a plumbing supply house would carry the orangeberg to pvc fernco.

    I have cesspools no sewers so I would be digging up a lot of pipe to get to the first pool. I will take your advice and ensure a tight connection and yes I am installing a riser for access outside the house.
  • Patchogue Phil_23
    Patchogue Phil_23 Member Posts: 12
    No roots?

    I am surprised that you do not have plant/tree roots going into the pipe holes.

    You might want to consider replacing the whole run of orangeburg with the PVC (green around here) sewer pipe that has a female flange on one end w/an O-ring for tight seal.

    My $0.02

    Walk Good

    Phil
  • Larry Weingarten
    Larry Weingarten Member Posts: 2,151
    pipe pulling

    Hello: This might be an ideal situation for using one of those "trenchless" tools that pulls a new line through the old one. You could replace the entire line now without connections except at the ends. Could beat digging up sections as they fail. Another 2 cents!
  • anthony_7
    anthony_7 Member Posts: 72
    your saying 4\" pvc will fit in OB?

    I can get a piece of 4" pvc and run it through the orangeburg? If that work I have no problems here. Will it fit.

    And the fernco fitting I do need if I go that route is 1051-44 same as ductile iron~
  • anthony_7
    anthony_7 Member Posts: 72
    whats the \"green\" for

    Why do they use green pipe instead of regular pvc? Whats the diff?
  • Matt Undy
    Matt Undy Member Posts: 256


    It depends. he is saying the orangburg may be a size bigger than than CI. Mine wasn't, mine was 4" so I had to but them end to end with a fernco. As for the correct fitting, measure the OD of the orangburg, fernco has the specs on their web site (www.fernco.com its a little hard to navigate), find the fitting with the OD of your orangburg designed to go to the OD of PVC. I think it is the ductile iron/asbestos cement fitting but check the dimensions on the charts yours may be a diffenrt size than mine was. BTW, does anyoen know if asbestos cement pipe is just transite and the same trnasite used for venting?

    Matt
  • Patchogue Phil_23
    Patchogue Phil_23 Member Posts: 12
    Why green?

    I dunno. Maybe that's what everyone around (Long Island)here stocks, from a particular manufacturer. Or it's been a coincidence for me that since mid 80's that's what I see being sold - at least when the pipe has a flange end with an O-ring. The "regular" white sewer PVC without the O-ring is thinner walled than the green stuff. More like DWV-type (sched-40).
  • Dave Stroman
    Dave Stroman Member Posts: 761


    Check out the ad from 1953.
    Dave in Denver
    Dave Stroman
  • Dave Stroman
    Dave Stroman Member Posts: 761


    Check out this ad from 1953.
    Dave in Denver
    Dave Stroman
  • Larry Weingarten
    Larry Weingarten Member Posts: 2,151
    on pulling pipe

    Hello: There are tools that pull pipe through existing pipe. They pull a wedge that actually splits the old pipe as it goes through, making room for the new pipe, (often polyethylene) which could be the same size as the old. This technique is used on old cast iron so orangeburg should be a breeze. The point is to make a quick job of it and avoid digging. I'd expect to have to hire it done as the tools are expensive and need training to use... I should add that perhaps you could downsize your main line one size if low flow fixtures allow. This is a good thing as toilets keep smaller lines scoured better than bigger lines.
  • scrook_2
    scrook_2 Member Posts: 610
    green

    seems to be the de facto standard color for sanitary sewer pipe w/ the rubber seals in the hubs. Guess it makes it easier to identify either at installation or subsequent digging form white PVC storm water drains or gray electrical PVC.
  • Mad Dog
    Mad Dog Member Posts: 2,595
    I Agree

    Replace with Bell & Spigot cast Iron can't beat it. Mad Dog

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  • grumpyplumber
    grumpyplumber Member Posts: 2


    Do it once, do it right, as I read this post, you are going to build over the first 15 feet of this repair? sch 40 or cast iron, conected at the house with a all rubber "fernco" w/stainless steel clamps, go at least the 15', install a cleanout (3'away from the new const. would be good). pl/ci by pl/ci all rubber fernco w/ ss clamps again, and if tree or shrub roots may become a problem,(any roots there now?)put 25# of water softner salt over the pipe AFTER you have bedded the pipe with some pea graval. As for the plastic pipe grades, sewer line comes in 3 weights, SCH 40, requred in the building, best for under outside decks, slads, sidewalks ect, 3034, thinner wall, 1/2 the price, they make a glue fitting to adapt 40 to 3034, diffrent od, and a weight called 2729 also known as eggshell. JUNK! the weight of the pipe is stamped on the pipe. Color of the pipe, white could be any of the weights above, green has allways been 3034 here but half the time the 3034 is white, just a manf. thing Heating giants, thanks for letting me "lurk".
  • Matt Undy
    Matt Undy Member Posts: 256
    Roots in CI?

    My understanding of hub and spigot CI buried in the ground is that the lead tends to fail underground then the joint leaks and gets full of roots, just like clay or orangeburg (providing it was cut cleanly, aligned, packed and leaded properly in the first place, you might have trouble finding somone who knows how to do this nowdays). I head the lead corrodes, but i suspect is has more to do with ground movement. The guy who cleaned the remaining part of my orangeburg who has been doing it for a couple decades and seemed to know exactly what he was doing said that the only materials that won't get roots are PVC and copper. If it were my sewer I would put in schedule 40 pvc with solvent welded fittings(not o rings). Once its solvent welded it becomes one piece and can't leak. The only drwaback is there is little room for expansion or movement. I might contemplate puting an o-ring fitting or actual expansion fiting in an area as far away from trees and as easily accessable as possible(not under the street or house).

    BTW, I had thought CI was the best job one could do before i heard about the joint issue. Sch 40 pvc seems durable enough to take drian cleaner cutting tools, which was the only reason i considered CI was that it may not have been strong enough to take roots being cut out of the line.


    As for the perforated pipe, if its a septic system they probably just used the same pipe for the feeder to the septic tank as for the leach field. My oppinion would tend to be that he might as well just replace a section because the whole system wil eventually need replacing when the leach field starts colapsing (and it is probably wet more of the time so it will degrade faster than the feeder). Of course if its a cespool and not a septic system, the leach field point is moot.

    I wish somone has some reasearch and a book on this, I have had to just pull together whatever pieces I coudl then amke an educated guess. There doesn't seem to be a serous plumbing book out there such as there is for wiring in "practical electrical wiring". The plumbing books all seem to have a lot of pictures and few technical details and aren't written to the level to allow the reader to properly do any residential job a professional could.

    Matt
  • kevin_5
    kevin_5 Member Posts: 308
    Whaddya mean roots?

    I just saw a tin sign in an antique store that guaranteed it to be "rootproof"! I must have imagined those rootballs in all the stuff we've dug up. Kevin

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