History of Plumbing in photos (s milne)

ScottMP

and gather around.

You old timers just jump in and help with the explanations.

We are renovating a house a good customer just bought and this is to be the boys bath. We noticed some lead pipe so, up came the floor.

There right in front of us is the best example I have seen in years of what the dead plumbers did.

Not only lead drains ( we see those often ) but lead water pipes still in use !!

Scott

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ScottMP

For those who dont know.

lead piping was how plumbing was done before cast iron. Lead was used for water piping also.

The Plumber would take a asbestos cloth and fold it. While holding it in his hand, he would take a ladle of Hot Molten lead and pour it into his hand. While he poured the molten lead he would wipe the pipe and make a joint.

Look at the water pipes and how they are connected.

How far we've come. Lead and asbestos.

" The Plumber protects the Health of the Nation "

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ScottMP

Heres a few more

Years ago when I was cleaning out my old boss's shop we found a lead drum trap "Still" in the box, brand new.

It dos'nt end here kids.

The old towns water supplies had very little preasure. So a Cistern Tank was built in the attic. This was an open tank that had a ballcock similer to a toilet. This allowed the water to flow in. The water piping was then piped 'down" to the fixtures. It gave the lower fixtures like the kitchen sink Great preasure.

These tanks where lined with copper and sometimes zinc, some even lead !

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Al Letellier

> lead piping was how plumbing was done before cast

> iron. Lead was used for water piping also.

>

> The

> Plumber would take a asbestos cloth and fold it.

> While holding it in his hand, he would take a

> ladle of Hot Molten lead and pour it into his

> hand. While he poured the molten lead he would

> wipe the pipe and make a joint.

>

> Look at the

> water pipes and how they are connected.

>

> How

> far we've come. Lead and asbestos.

>

> " The

> Plumber protects the Health of the Nation "

> _A

> HREF="http://www.heatinghelp.com/getListed.cfm?id=

> 237&Step=30"_To Learn More About This

> Professional, Click Here to Visit Their Ad in

> "Find A Professional"_/A_





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ScottMP

Sorry

We took out the wall hung tank for the bowl before I took pictures. Here is the feed that came out high up on the wall to feed the tank.

This dos'nt show the "Local vent" that vented the bowl only to remove " Ye Ole Odour " . This was piped up to the chimney and was attached to the plumbing venting.


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Al Letellier

lead piping

Thanks for the memories, Scott. Poured my first lead and oakum joint when I was 5 and wiped my first joint at 8. My great-granddad was a roofer by trade and fabricated a lot of fittings for the plumbers back in the 90's (1890's that is) before he became a plumber himself. Then granddad, dad, me and 26 others in the family tree over 4 generations....love that photo of the tub trap with the side cleanout plug...that is a rare one indeed...worthy of being saved for posperity in a museum or collection somewhere. Have a lot of the old pump up torches they used to use...like to see a young apprentice today fire on of those up and solder with it!!!!

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Al Letellier

local vent

AKA "poop vent"!!!

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ScottMP

Thanks for speaking up Al

I tried to photo some of the old torches but ran out of battries.

Tell us more about how the joint was made ...

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JB_2

old days

got to love these old homes ! check out the wiring.still working?

Unknown

Love seeing that old stuff

Thanks Scott for posting the pics . We never see anything older than the 1940s .

Darin Cook_2

Very Cool!!!

Scott, there is a lot of this old plumbing still in operation in the Albany, NY area. It used to crack me up when they started making us use 95/5 but the service coming in was pure lead. I could never get any of the old timers to wipe a lead joint for me. That is another lost art. When you have to tie on to lead pipe with a ford coupling it is always a challenge to get the right size, and you might have to do a little shaving with the jackknife to make it fit. You could always count on a newbie to run the gunsnake through the sidewall of a lead drain in a ceiling, then scratch his head at what the dead men had left him. Thanks for the cool pics!!

Mike Kraft_2

Scott unearths.......................

heavy metal.Turn it into gold:)A new twist on alchemey...........plumbing remodel.......turning the lead into greenbacks:)Nice find.

cheese

sootmonkey

Plumbers

Nothing makes me as happy as flushing something down, and never seeing it again. You don't know the feeling, until you have a frozen septic. A cold one on me for the plumbers.

jackchips_2

Great stuff

Scott, thanks for posting.

I took the journeyman exam right around the time they stopped requiring a wiped joint-only a soldered fitting.

Larry Weingarten

cistern gizmo? etc.

Hello: I see a gizmo with a wire attached to it, behind the fill valve. It looks like one would pull the wire from below and expect some result. Any idea what it was for? Maybe a way to raise the float when water overflows and drips through the ceiling? By the bye, the cistern is still common in British plumbing, from what I've seen... Do you think some of that old lead drain line would be quieter in use than ABS?... Those are some really nice wiped joints! I've got a book on just how to do it if anyone wants to do irreparable harm to their hands. Thanks for sharing.

Unknown

Hey Scott, I've got another one for you.

The toilet tank needs parts, and the seat is tired....

Can you save it, or do you think it's time to remodel?

Noel

Jim Bennett

Wow! That's what I call Art! Been doing plumbing going on 25 years, occasionaly pull out some lead drainage, but I have never seen lead water lines!! Cool pics!

Jim

bob young

LEAD WORK

GREAT PHOTO'S OF TRUE LEAD WORK.SOME OF IT WAS TRULY WORKS OF ART. ESPECIALLY THE VENTING FRAMES THAT WERE PREFABED ON THE KITCHEN FLOOR!! EXPOSED WATER RISERS HAD ORNAMENTAL STRAPS SOLDERED TO THE PIPING.DID PLENTY OF WIPING IN THE SIXTIES ,IT WAS INTERESTING BUT DIFFICULT. TAKING THE N.Y.C. TEST MAY HAVE BEEN THE HARDEST DAY OF MY LIFE .FOUR SOLID HOURS OF WIPING AND FITTING AND YOU ACTUALLY NEEDED EIGHT HOURS. ONE SLIP UP AND INSTANT FAILURE. KEPT THE RIFT -RAFF FROM GETTING A LICENSE. REAL CRAFTSMENSHIP AND LOVE TO LOOK AT IT BUT GLAD ITS OVER.

ScottMP

Bob

I am sure if it shows in any of the photos but, there are brackets that attach the lead risers to the wall. I don't think they are ornamental.

I took the two "young" guys on the job and made them stop and look at this work. I told them as much as I could about the old work. I think it does them good to see what came before us.

Scott

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ScottMP

Yes it is

In the photo of the stack you can see a group of wires together. I believe these are for the alerting system that told the maid what room was calling her. There would be a box with little arrows and when a button was pressed in the room the arrow jumped up in the box.

Anyone know the true name for this ?

Scott

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Nick W

Latin

The latin word for lead is "plumbum". The latin word for plumber, which escapes me now, translates to "leadworker". I always thought that was interesting.

Look at this photo too see how a new "plumber" repaired an installation like my Dad might have typically done. Notice the ill-fitted Fernco coupling and PVC floor flange connecting that lead bend.
And yes, that's lead water pipe encased in concrete (ash?) between the 5th and 6th floors of a Manhattan residential building.



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ScottMP

Looked this up

On a latin to English website and this was the best I got..

plumbum -i n. [lead; a bullet; a leaden pipe]; 'plumbum album' , [tin].

I was told that Plum was lead and Bum was a worker, a worker of lead. I had a hard time finding a website that could confirm that.

Its appears that Plumbum or Plumber was a lead pipe !

Scott



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jerrygb46_5

wires?

I do believe that type of wireing was called "knob and tube" as far as the box i think it was called a "Anuncator" or something like that ??

Kal Row

you guys are so geelfull at the find

just remember that all the Tsars that were carried by their pregnant mother in the Kremlin with the lead pipes - were mentally ill, Ivan the treble is a shining example of that, Peter the Grate’s mother on the other hand wasn't even allowed in - this stuff is real real dangerous

Kal Row

look how i spelled

Peter the "Grate’s" (great's) - there must have lead in my water too ;-)

Art Pittaway

Thanks Mr. Milne..!

I hope it's OK, I've taken copies of the photo's onto Power Point. I teach a class called Residential Mechanical Systems at the local Comm. College to introduce students looking for a spot in the trades to how Electric, Plumbing and HVAC systems work and work together. And I have wanted some shots of Lead joints to show. I tell them you have to know where the stuff came from, in order to take it into the future. Went through a mansion in LaSalle/Peru Illinois, built by the Carus Chemical Co. family. Lead pipe and lead lined cistern in the tower. Servant used a hand pump in the basement to pump the tank full. Last two living relatives still lived in the mansion (mid 90's)each had a floor to themselves and didn't like or talk to each other. Contractor I was with said, "the whole family was nuts". Thanks again for the great shots. Art

BillW@honeywell

They are called \"Annunciators\"...

There is one in the crew quarters of the railroad car. A client pushes a button in their stateroom or the lounge or dining room, a bell rings, and a location pops up mechanically on the box. The steward then goes to the location indicated to take care of whatever they want. Most first-class railroad cars had them; office cars, Pullman sleepers and Parlor Cars. Lots of old mansions did, too.

Jimmy Gillies

Lead wiped joints.

As a very young man starting my 'time' as an apprentice in 1974. You were still expected to be able to 'wipe' a joint in lead pipe with a mole skin wiping cloth. flux & a bar of solder. After mastering the craft of wiping a 'ball' joint on the work bench, you next had to do it UNDER the bench - because it was always in the most cramp locations most of our work was done.
We were not installing lead pipe but with many old houses, you needed to join onto it.
Thanks Scott for all the great pictures.
Regards.
Jimmy Gillies Scotland.

LEAD PIPE

LEAD PIPE

I will not stand for all this lead pipe bashing.

ScottMP

Kal,

We are quite aware of how dangerous lead is. Thast why I put the quote about the "protecting the health of the nation ".

Those who do not know history are doomed to repeat it !

Its good to see where we came from and it gives us a sense of who we are.

I'm glad everyone enjoys this as much as I did. Kinda of a Wallie museum.

Scott

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Mad Dog

That's how I earned my master plumber's license

wiped lots of lead joints. Just 6 years ago. AAA lead for water services - just for practice. Wiping lead and being competant in screw pipe sets apart the real plumbers from today's "plastic plumbers." Lead and asbestos are great materials that HAVE protected the health of MANY nations and the greatest civilizations, mesopotamia, Greece and Roman. There is a great deal of hype about the dangers of both - just don't ingest either and you'll live a long life. Mad Dog

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Mad Dog

Next time you in Long Island......I'll put a joint up for ya pal

You'll love it. Mad Dog

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ScottMP

Oh no thanks Dude

Not since college.

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Constantin

Found some!

I just found some lead pipe in the house... yay! I'm trying to photograph everything before it is ripped out... knob and tube insulation, cast iron boxes for the wiring, gas lighting (!!!) supply converted to electricity, etc. We have a veritable archeologist dig here as far as infrastructure is concerned.

And... demo guys work fast!

Mike Reavis_2

DC lead water service--everyone is going into restaurants

and asking for "unleaded" water. There are thousands of these all over the District, and they are all over the news. Mike