Historic Minimalistic Modern Radiant

Unknown

Commissioned in 1946 this modern marvel is getting an extreeme facelift nearly 60 years later. The house is known in historical circles as the Kaplan House.

This landmark home home was designed by the members of one of the most influential groups in modern architecture, The Architect's Collaborative, or TAC, led by contemporary pioneer and Bauhaus designer Walter Gropius.

The steel piping embedded in the 6" suspended slab radiant floor is still intact. The owners have requested that the radiant system be maintained or replaced. The challenge I face is how?

Anyone know how this system would have been laid out? Note the plugged 1/4" nipples coming down from the suspended concrete slab next to the header. What was their purpose? Air removal? Any feedback as to how to approach a job of this magnitude is greatly appreciated.

AIM user name: Radiantfloors

<A HREF="http://www.heatinghelp.com/getListed.cfm?id=296&Step=30">To Learn More About This Professional, Click Here to Visit Their Ad in "Find A Professional"</A>

Unknown

AIM user name: Radiantfloors

To Learn More About This Professional, Click Here to Visit Their Ad in "Find A Professional"

Mike T., Swampeast MO

In photo named Gripous2 it appears there is one of the large feeds and one of the small pipes (like in manifold photo). Is that correct? Air removal sure seems to be likely--perhaps the small pipes start near the middle of the loop (connecting off the top) and then bee-line back to the loop origin?

Is that a fireplace I see in the interior shot? Looks kind of like a 50s TV screen. Cool.

George_10

Now I can see exactly what you were talking about

> Commissioned in 1946 this modern marvel is

> getting an extreeme facelift nearly 60 years

> later. The house is known in historical circles

> as the Kaplan House.

>

> This landmark home home

> was designed by the members of one of the most

> influential groups in modern architecture, The

> Architect's Collaborative, or TAC, led by

> contemporary pioneer and Bauhaus designer Walter

> Gropius.

>

> The steel piping embedded in the 6"

> suspended slab radiant floor is still intact. The

> owners have requested that the radiant system be

> maintained or replaced. The challenge I face is

> how?

>

> Anyone know how this system would have

> been laid out? Note the plugged 1/4" nipples

> coming down from the suspended concrete slab next

> to the header. What was their purpose? Air

> removal? Any feedback as to how to approach a job

> of this magnitude is greatly appreciated.

>

> AIM

> user name: Radiantfloors

>

> _A

> HREF="http://www.heatinghelp.com/getListed.cfm?id=

> 296&Step=30"_To Learn More About This

> Professional, Click Here to Visit Their Ad in

> "Find A Professional"_/A_

George_10

Now I can see what we were talking about

Were you able to get Bill Duncan on the phone. He has the same attitude about helping as I believe in. Good luck figuring this one out.

Weezbo

test...

plug all the sliced pipes...valve off the small pipes ..pump air into the headders one at a time. ... the plugs can be a cap with a hose bib attach ment. lash up a pressure gauge to each zone... first... stell pipe radiant if it has a chance to freeze a couple times can be a bugger check them zone by zone at like what ever pressure the boiler was functioning at, too high a pressure may cause leaks....there are some inflateable ball type plugs you may use for the "Inspection T's"... once the tests have been accomplished you are in the position of where to Begin.

Allied

Kaplan House

Love that place, though the International Style is a contrast to most of Newton, Ma.

Are they going to keep the large windows single pane?

I love the narrow vertical board siding and flat roof.

Unknown

Mike, That's rebar not tubing.

I can't seem to find any of the 1/4" tubing anywhere elce in the slab. But, somehow I remember seeing some on the main level. Could have been broken off by the trackhoe whilst being subjected to demolition yesterday.

That is one cute little fireplace isn't it? They're going to keep it and of course it will be restored. Your right. It looks just like an old TV set. "History is cool" (DH)

There is a museum in Lincoln MA that is named after this German Gropius charictor. He designed many giant buildings of steel and copious amounts of Gropius glass. (G) I imagine him trying to figure out how to keep the people warm inside his huge (single pane) glass buildings. I'll bet that's how he started using radiant floors. That or he just stole from Frank Lord Wright:-)

The decision was made today for me to abandon the steel radiant tubing. 60 years was "good enough" for the new owner and I concur. The new cap pour over PAP should last even more than that.

To Learn More About This Professional, Click Here to Visit Their Ad in "Find A Professional"

Weezbo

now...Pap might let it live another 60:)

using the pap will keep the Hysterical society away from disscussing your last job:)

Mark Hunt

Yes Gary


those plugged 1/4" lines are for air removal.

Looks like you have a good one going there!

Mark H

To Learn More About This Professional, Click Here to Visit Their Ad in "Find A Professional"

Paul Pollets

To Be or Not To Be

The pipe looks pretty decent, but it's what you can't see that may be problematic....The 1/4" lines are air bleeders (I'm working on a similar system in Seattle with same bleeder method) Is there serious pitting inside the piping? While it may have a few years left in it, I would replace the system with new PEX and be able to provide a specific warranty on the system. It would also allow for better distribution and system balancing. It may be difficult and expensive, but well worth it. Renovating historic structures require careful thought regarding how long each system will last before creating damages. Or excessive energy costs. Do the right thing!

To Learn More About This Professional, Click Here to Visit Their Ad in "Find A Professional"

ScottMP

Somethings

have historical value, others are just a period product.

Allthought the original tubing was done well in its time, it Do'es have a shelf life. It would be a pity to put Thousands of dollars into this home and then hammer up the floors two years from now to repair a leak and maybe do it again in another year and then ......

I would replace it.

An American Standard Arco liner may well have been the original boiler I would hope they would not reuse it.

Scott

To Learn More About This Professional, Click Here to Visit Their Ad in "Find A Professional"

Unknown

Will be new system

I find it facinating that this house of glass was so comfortable. The present owners told me that they were really-really comfortable with that old floor. Even with all that single pane glass that this well know TAC architect group was famous for. In the basement, the slab above acted as a radiant ceilling and kept everything cozy down there as well according to owners.

We're going to use foam insulation board and an 1 1/2" of concrete cap poured over the existing suspended slab. I'm waiting to hear back from the structural engineer if the foundation can support the added weight. I'll zone and ballance the new rooms off accordingly. Lots of South facing glass

AIM user name: Radiantfloors

To Learn More About This Professional, Click Here to Visit Their Ad in "Find A Professional"

Unknown

Thanks George.

If I ever need "Superman-vision" I'll know where to go.

He was extremly helpfull. X ray vision will not be required here. Whole new system happening now.

Rhomar water products are AWESOME!!! I love the Ph. tester.

Thanks for all you do.

G.

To Learn More About This Professional, Click Here to Visit Their Ad in "Find A Professional"

Unknown

I'm confused Allied,,,

Allied,

Where did you get that photo?

Confused as to who you are?

AIM user name: Radiantfloors

To Learn More About This Professional, Click Here to Visit Their Ad in "Find A Professional"

hr

Makes me wonder

if that large diameter steel pipe doubled as reinforcing on that suspended slab. It needed something!

hot rod

To Learn More About This Professional, Click Here to Visit Their Ad in "Find A Professional"

Unknown

The steel pipe is schedule 80.

I'm not sure if the tubing was meant as reinforcing or not. Lots of rebar in the slab. It surely did add to the strength of the slab. Not one crack in the entire structure.

The owners have the original plans. Unfortunately, they don't contain any layouts for the radiant steel piping system.

I'm waiting to hear back from the structural engineer as to weather or not he will sign off on the extra weight I'm planning to add to the floor. About 14 Lbs. Sq/Ft for 1 1/2" of Levelrock RH. I may be able to use concrete but, I'm not sure how much it will weigh though? Anybody have that information?

AIM user name: Radiantfloors

To Learn More About This Professional, Click Here to Visit Their Ad in "Find A Professional"

Unknown

Weezy,,,

My last job? !!! What you talkin about Weezy?


AIM user name: Radiantfloors

To Learn More About This Professional, Click Here to Visit Their Ad in "Find A Professional"

Weezbo

Dude! say you piped in that steel pipe...

every thing is looking good the historical fathers are around to blab it all up and everythin...and low and behold kisss spulurge woosh water showering down out 12 different new holes )) i done steel pipe repairs on a snow melt used in alaska designed in california ))) The Hysterical society never got wind of it thank god:))) i'm thinking the pap will last a hecka lot longer than going with the existing pipes.trust me you could test the things and heat it up and it would leak in 12 new places:))) no offence ...

LKE

concrete weight

The weight of regular portland cement concrete is 145 to 150 lb. per cubic foot. At one and a half inches that would be about 18 lb. per square foot. By using lightweight aggregates you could lower that to 12 lb. per sq.ft. depending on how the mix was designed. Their are some other not well known options available that have very desirable qualities but at a premium price.

Unknown

Still confused about those small tubes?

I know they were for air removal. Where could the other end be located? Why were they just plugged off with no petcock?

AIM user name: Radiantfloors

To Learn More About This Professional, Click Here to Visit Their Ad in "Find A Professional"

Vnxdwoet

Veryjlrb good Sitenspi!

http://www.gacirgicprkblwpu.com [url=http://www.harxtgiczsocltzi.com] site2[/url] site3 site4 [url="http://www.lauejgicbjcglvng.com"] site5[/url] [LINK http://www.maqjsgiccifhljfy.com] site6[/LINK] xqngl

Vnxdwoet

Verytmsy good Sitetzfy!

http://www.gayekgicslublpvb.com [url=http://www.hawcvgicxqmclunx.com] site2[/url] site3 site4 [url="http://www.lapsxgiczbxglbua.com"] site5[/url] [LINK http://www.markdgiciozhlpex.com] site6[/LINK] mcixd