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A Tale of Two Vitodens - DF
Dan Foley
Member Posts: 1,264
Flag looked at this job in DC a couple of months ago. The homeowner had done his research and decided on a new Vitodens boiler and indirect tank for a rowhouse he was remodeling. Steve surveyed the job and prepared a proposal. Steve also noted our capabilities and experience installing this boiler.
A couple of weeks passed before Steve heard back from the HO. He wanted us to do the job but at the other contractor's price which was $8,500.00 less than our price. Of course we couldn't do the job at that price so the homeowner indicated he was going with contractor B. Steve warned the HO to be careful because it was impossible to do the job at that price level knowing what the equipment cost and the amount of work involved.
Another couple of weeks passed before Steve heard from the homeowner again. This time he wanted to know if we could fix the mess in the basement. Steve agreed to look at the job at our normal service rates. He found a disaster. The boiler was not even remotely installed to the manufacturer's instruction manual.
Th expansion tank was mounted on an arm of 1/2" copper about 16" long without any means of support. The weight of the tank caused the fitting to break loose while the HO was at work. The water ran all day flooding his basement. In addition, the water sprayed on the boiler soaking all of the components. The electronic control was still in the box, bobbing on the water and thoroughly saturated.
Steve told the homeowner that we would not touch this one with a ten foot pole and collected for the service call. He did let him know that we would gladly do the job at our previous price with new equipment. There was no way we would accept the liability involved with installing equipment that had been soaked with water.
After considering his options, the homeowner accepted Steve's proposal and we installed the system properly without any problems. You can check out the HO's perspective at this link:
http://hvac-talk.com/vbb/showthread.php?threadid=46697
To quote ME "you may not always get what you pay for but you NEVER get what you DON'T pay for". Thanks, Mark - I love that quote.
-DF
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A couple of weeks passed before Steve heard back from the HO. He wanted us to do the job but at the other contractor's price which was $8,500.00 less than our price. Of course we couldn't do the job at that price so the homeowner indicated he was going with contractor B. Steve warned the HO to be careful because it was impossible to do the job at that price level knowing what the equipment cost and the amount of work involved.
Another couple of weeks passed before Steve heard from the homeowner again. This time he wanted to know if we could fix the mess in the basement. Steve agreed to look at the job at our normal service rates. He found a disaster. The boiler was not even remotely installed to the manufacturer's instruction manual.
Th expansion tank was mounted on an arm of 1/2" copper about 16" long without any means of support. The weight of the tank caused the fitting to break loose while the HO was at work. The water ran all day flooding his basement. In addition, the water sprayed on the boiler soaking all of the components. The electronic control was still in the box, bobbing on the water and thoroughly saturated.
Steve told the homeowner that we would not touch this one with a ten foot pole and collected for the service call. He did let him know that we would gladly do the job at our previous price with new equipment. There was no way we would accept the liability involved with installing equipment that had been soaked with water.
After considering his options, the homeowner accepted Steve's proposal and we installed the system properly without any problems. You can check out the HO's perspective at this link:
http://hvac-talk.com/vbb/showthread.php?threadid=46697
To quote ME "you may not always get what you pay for but you NEVER get what you DON'T pay for". Thanks, Mark - I love that quote.
-DF
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Comments
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After
Here are some pics of the completed job.
-DF
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I see this alot
why do guys think they can hang tanks from a pipe like that. Does anyone pick these things up and say "hey this is kinda heavy ? " .
Beautiful work, very neat.
What did the other contractor think the low loss header was for ?
Scott
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LLH
Scott, thank you for the comments. We never did find the low loss header. The insulation was floating around in the basement but the LLH was nowhere to be seen. Maybe he didn't know what to do with it so he pitched it?
-DF
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Nice salvage, Dan
and Flag. Wonder how such a nice boiler got into the hands of the first installer. Not your typical pathological V installer, job! Bet some phones are ringing this morning
hot rod
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Credit given when credit due...
That's a Heatboyism, not a MEism:-) I just use it all the time. How true it is. Good job guys. This SHOULD end up in a national magazine somewhere, but I won't hold my breath..
ME0 -
It's great
... to hear the other side of the story. From reading the artcle that the HO posted, one got the impression that he couldn't find a qualified installer. Now we know better.
On the other hand, the folks that installed the first Viessmann were obviously not prepared for the job. Having functionally illiterate installers running an unspervised install is asking for trouble.0 -
Jeez....
now that before set of pics.....Thats No Way To Treat a Viessman) Yikes! If i could show you one picture it would be of a hotel install...Pesonally said i i'd cut their fingers off if they did that with my materials. 0 -
SAD
Another case where you get what you pay for i see it all the time what really gets me is the supply houses that sell to those guys. I bid one and lost it and the supply house told me that they didn't really want to sell to the other guy but "hey it's money". After the original installer didn't complete the job he went banktrupt and stiffed the supply house. Then the suplier was out to the job a few times trying to fix it so they wouldn't get sued (on a job they didn't get payed for) Gotta love it made my day heck it made my month!!!! nice job fixing the mess!
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Nice Job!
Hey dan whats wrong with flag? I notice he is standing straight. He is using the boiler to hold himself up right?
All kinding aside looks good tell steve he did a good job.
John Jr.0 -
What About \"Renting\" Licenses
A relative just finished building a house. The first month, the electricity bill was $3,500. This is what happens when the emergency strip heaters and the cooling circuits are run simultaneously...
The guy doing the thermostat wiring didn't have a license, did the job for a friend who had too much to do (friend was the one who accepted the bid). To make a long story short, said friend decided that declaring bankruptcy was cheaper than paying for the problems that the installer had caused in this and other houses.
There is a good reason to go with bonded contractors who know what they're doing!0 -
I saw that
on HVAC-talk in the "Wall of Shame". What a disaster!
Looks GREAT now!
Nice work!
Mark H
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Seeing those original.......
pictures brought a tear to my eye, Dan. The guy should be beaten with some old Entran 2. Knowing you are in charge of the Vitodens RX allowed me to sleep soundly last night. If there was ever a reason I would favor certification, these pictures are it.
See you at Wetstock!
hb
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0 -
Finally!!
A good use for E-2....
Be careful of the exploding chards if you decide to use it for floggings, and make sure its approved for that use:-)
ME
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