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Improper Hartford Loop

Ken_8
Ken_8 Member Posts: 1,640
in THE MAIN WALL
The hartford loop enters the equalizer 2" above the NOWL (or LWCO set point level) instead of below?

I just encountered that one on a steam system that sounds like the anvil chorus on first steaming after a cold start (day/night morning start).

Many other things are wrong with the system piping, but I wonder what that particular error may be causing. I cannot see that item as a contributor to the cold start water hammer.

Comments please.

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Comments

  • Unknown
    Unknown
    Ain't that what they call the Gifford Loop ?

    I remember reading about that somewhere - either online here or in a magazine . Anyone know where to find info on it ?
  • Boilerpro_3
    Boilerpro_3 Member Posts: 1,231
    It seems the recommended Hartford loop height

    varies with the seasons of the moon. There seems to be no consistant pattern in manufacturer literature other than at least above the minimum water line of the boiler. JMHO.

    Boilerpro
  • Ken_8
    Ken_8 Member Posts: 1,640
    Really?

    I thought all mnufacturers wanted it around 2" below the water line.

    Oh well.

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  • Unknown
    Unknown
    Yep , the ones we use

    call for the loop to be at least 2 inches below normal water line . Hey Ken , I just found a 3 page article that goes into detail about the Gifford Loop . I had it stuffed away with some junk . I'll see if I can scan it and post it here . I hope that don't infringe on copyright laws .
  • Mad Dog
    Mad Dog Member Posts: 2,595
    Looking foward to seeing the frank Gifford loop

    I believe WM and Burnham have always said 2" below water line...as long as I've been doin it. MD

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  • Unknown
    Unknown
    Here they are

    It came out pretty grainy - I had to scan my copy which was not in good shape to begin . I had to save them as Microsoft Word Documents . If anyone knows how to change a Word Document to .jpg , feel free to change these .
  • Ken_8
    Ken_8 Member Posts: 1,640
    Ron,

    Thanks!

    Two people gave me a source for that and I found the archival resource - but not being a "member" of that particular authors "club"...

    Two arms and one leg were the charges.

    BTW, I suspect the reason the Gifford Loop never found much favor is becxause the possibility of small content boilers (like those of today) would have more water hammer if the return was that close to the steaming surface and chest dynaimcs. It's already "busy" enough in there without introducing cool water an inch or two below the water line - rather than the more common Hartford setup of say 6 to 10 inches below the NOWL?

    But than you for digging that one out.

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