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Sept. 11, 2001

Mad Dog
Mad Dog Member Posts: 2,595
I'll be picking up another case very soon. The biggest impediment I see from contractors is fear: They would rather bury their heads in the sand than take a little initiative and responsibility and learn what cause CO and how to prevent it. Mad Dog

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Comments

  • Mark Hunt
    Mark Hunt Member Posts: 4,909
    3000 people killed

    in America by a terrorist group called Al Queda.

    Since that time, they have not been able to kill another American citizen here at home.

    Since that time, 6000+ people have been killed by Carbon Monoxide here in the USA.

    Mark H



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  • jackchips_2
    jackchips_2 Member Posts: 1,338
    Keep up

    the fight, Mark.

    Oh, and there have been over 90,000 killed on our highways in that same time.
  • Mark Hunt
    Mark Hunt Member Posts: 4,909
    I will Jack

    Seems we get new laws every year regarding safe driving.

    Did you know that the 800ppm allowable CO emission standard for gas stoves was introduced in 1921 and hasn't been addressed since then?

    Back then stoves were vented to the outdoors.

    I am looking forward to this battle.

    Mark H

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  • Bill Nye
    Bill Nye Member Posts: 221
    Ouch.

    ......
  • Murph'_4
    Murph'_4 Member Posts: 209
    how much money....

    Is spent on awareness of seat belts, drunk driving, preventing forest fires, no-smoking, save the whales and such !! This is treated by the media as if it was a health issue, only reporting after someone dies!! this is preventable !!



    Murph'
  • The Battle may mean

    we all have to quit our day jobs and go door to door visiting every contractor across the land to make them aware.

    I was just turned down by an insurance company I approached about giving a safety seminar on Carbon Monoxide. They are a big workmens compensation provider. They stated that CO was not a real problem for them as it relates to insurance problems. Hey I was even going to do it for FREE!!!
  • Mark Eatherton1
    Mark Eatherton1 Member Posts: 2,542
    Man...

    sounds like pushing a dead elephant up hill to me...

    Ya need some help?

    I'll push.

    ME
  • Mark Hunt
    Mark Hunt Member Posts: 4,909
    Ahhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh


    contractors are part of the equation.

    Homeowners are the biggest part. When we educate them, the contractors will follow or disappear.

    Did round one with a manager from FW WEBB today.

    I was nice! Next time we turn up the heat.

    Mark H

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  • Al D'Ambola
    Al D'Ambola Member Posts: 18
    Training one at a time

    we are taking this to the grass root level of contractors one at a time. And you contractors trying your best to educate one customer at time. It seems like and impossible task but we will not stop! Based on the passion here at the wall I know there is no stopping!!

    Mark that was awesome info about about stoves since the days Ruth & Gerhig nothing has changed.

    www.ncinstitute.com click on seminars, scrool to CO & Combustion fine a seminar in your area and help save a life.
  • jp_2
    jp_2 Member Posts: 1,935
    CO monitoring sensors

    what would it cost(mat'l) to install a relaiable CO monitor/control(alarm or shut off) into/on/nearby most gas appliances- mostly larger gas appliances I would assume?
    why are these appliances failing in the first place?
    house monitors seem fine but I would rather see monitoring closer to the source, catch the problem before it gets way out of hand. plus one in the general house.
  • Steamhead
    Steamhead Member Posts: 16,714
    One of the problems

    is that the standards have not been revised in so many years. Another is the way some appliances are tested.

    For example, gas stoves are tested with the oven floor, pan holders etc. removed. This sidesteps the issue of flame impingement on cold metal, which is one thing that produces lots of CO. It has nothing to do with the way this equipment is operated in real life.

    Yesterday I tested a stove that had been in place for about a year. Oven and broiler were both over 1100 PPM- that's when I shut the Testo down. With a few simple adjustments I got them down below 100 PPM. If I can do it, there's no reason someone else can't.

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  • Al D'Ambola
    Al D'Ambola Member Posts: 18
    CO Monitors

    the best one that I have seen is the CO Experts they sound an alarm at 10ppm. Keep them at eye level not low on the wall. CO lighter than O2 + it is usally heated it will rise.

    The ones from the hardware stores go off at 70ppm after 4 hours, we refer to them as a death alarm.
  • Mark Hunt
    Mark Hunt Member Posts: 4,909
    MAYBE they go off!


    HEY AL!!!

    I've tested quite a few CO alarms that wouldn't sound alarms at over 400ppm! Not after 10 minutes, 20 minutes or even 45 minutes.

    NOTHING!

    Brand new, out of the box!

    I tell my customres that one of the "standard" CO alarms may only be helpful to the EMT's in explaining why you are lying on the floor.

    There are a few companies making BIG bucks selling ineffectual equipment. They are NOT required to test ANY of their goods before they leave the assembly line. The model submitted for approval buys them a pass indefinately.

    Question for those interested:

    How long will a CO alarm last?

    Mark H





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  • Glenn Harrison_2
    Glenn Harrison_2 Member Posts: 845
    I'll take a guess

    Nobody really knows. I have read recomendations of 10 year replacements. Somehow I can't see them being good past five years, if that. Heck my Testo CO sensor only lasted 3 years , and it's a professional grade testing instrument.
  • Mark Hunt
    Mark Hunt Member Posts: 4,909
    Sorry Glenn!!!!!


    A CO alarm will last until a test says it is no good.

    If you don't test CO alarms, you don't know.

    There are kits available for testing CO alarms.

    Mark H

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  • Kal Row
    Kal Row Member Posts: 1,520
    200,000+ medical failure fatalities per year globaly

    more than 100k in this country alone,
    more than all accidents, murders (terorist or otherwise), and wars, combined - a hospital is no place to a sick person!!! - that last time california had a doctors strike, the statewide death rate droppped 80%, that was the last doctors strike in california - makes you wonder who the real terrorists are
  • Mark Hunt
    Mark Hunt Member Posts: 4,909
    CO posoning


    is more often than not misdiagnosed.

    So even the doctors need to get trained.

    If you have ANY doubts, check out Dr. David Penny's site at

    www.cohq.com

    This one will blow your mind.

    Mark H

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  • Murph'_4
    Murph'_4 Member Posts: 209
    DOT COM CO. ON CO SAYS

    THEY (ELECTROCHEMICAL) SENSORS WILL GO ABOUT FOUR YEARS !! The trick is to get on that "tests" the sensor!! most will not, they check the circuitry and the battery, THATS ALL!!



    Murph'
  • Mark Hunt
    Mark Hunt Member Posts: 4,909
    You're right Murph


    The test button on the majoority of "CO alarms" only test the battery and the circuitry, not the sensor.

    So if you have a CO alarm that you bought from a big box, when you want to test it, go and ring your doorbell.

    That will be about as useful.

    Mark H

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  • Mad Dog
    Mad Dog Member Posts: 2,595
    Het Murph.are you comin' up to hang

    with me Hunt, and Jim Davis??????? Mad Dog

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  • Mark Hunt
    Mark Hunt Member Posts: 4,909
    No MADDOG


    Murph has a pottery class that week.

    He sent me an ashtray last month.

    At least I think that's what it was...........

    Mark H

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This discussion has been closed.