veissmann,buderus,or system 2000

Jon Poland

I'm looking for some advice on what boiler to put in my new house. Being a heating contractor myself, and a big fan of The Wall, I thought you guys could give me that advice. I've installed most everything.Weil-Mclain, burnham, New Yorker,H.B. Smith,Biasi,etc. Now I've decided to try some more advanced brands, starting in my own house.
What I have is a radiant slab in the basement, plate and strapping radiant on the first floor, and underfit for the two baths on the second floor with some thrown in the walls and ceilings in the second floor baths. The three bedrooms are baseboard, and there is a 40 gallon indirect as abuffer tank as well. A Tekmar 368 will control the system, unless I decide to use one of the contolers that comes with the boiler. Now, what is the quietest, most efficient, best performing boiler out there today? I would appreciate the input.

S Davis

What type of fuel are you planning to use?

S Davis

kevin coppinger_4

if you doing Nautral...

gas look at a Munchkin....oil I like The Buderus 115 (its what i have)w/ a Carlin or Riello, the carlin is quieter. Riello a solid performer. kpc

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Steve Ebels

Info needed

What's your heat loss and what fuel are you using? Then I can get specific.

Generaly speaking, if the fuel is gas and you have a system that you can obtain low return temps with, I still have to say the Viessmann Vitodens is the king of the hill. I have to say I like and install Munchkin boilers and have had good success with them but if it was my own house and I wanted the best it would be the Viessman unit.

If it's oil, it would be a toss up between the Buderus G series oil units and the Vitorond from Viessmann. Both are fantastic performers. 85% to 87% is easily attainable.

John Felciano

No contest

Viessmann,They have a top performing boiler no matter what the fuel and their controls are state of the art.

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lchmb

opinion

I personally like the performance of the system 2000..whether gas or oil..although the oil system has a little more time under it's belt and most problem's worked out..as to the gentleman who mentioned the munchkin boiler...They are extremely quiet due to the fact they don't stay running longer than a month at a time..I have had nothing but bad luck with them...just an opinion

Jon Poland

more info

Sorry about the lack of info. Im in the great state of Maine where 90% of the boilers are oil. The heat loss is less than 65K btu. What about the Veissmanns burner? Is it what you would hope to get, or would you suggest a Riello? Are they loud? How about the controls?

kevin coppinger_4

what are you using...

for a distibution system? Radiant floor? Baseboard, panels Hydro air? Combo of many? kpc

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Justin Gavin

my 2 cents

I would say this. Efficiecy is only as good as the design. Instead of the boiler I would really consider the design of the system. It sounds like you are adding Hi-Temp and Low-Temp equipment. So I assume you are going primary secondary with a mixing loop. If that is the case than does it really pay to spend all that money on a boiler to gain a few % on efficiency?

You will be running your boiler on reset so that will save you money there.

From what I see the only real low temp you are running is for the basement slab. I would suggest using a 3 way thermostatic mixing valve for that zone. They are reliable and you aren't really going to be down there all the time unless it is a split level. If it is than you might want to use injection mixing.

Now add a Tekmar 362 control with injection mixing and you take care of all the low temp radiant. If you want to spend the money. (I don't know how much you are sending upstairs for the radiant walls.

But if the load demands it use the injection loop.

It will take you many years to get the high cost back of the boiler when you are talking a few points of efficiency. A good domestic boiler will do you just fine.

If you are really want to get a foreign manf. boiler you might consider a De Dietrich as well.

The main difference you get between the foreign boilers and the doemestic (besides a few % in Effy) the resistance to thermal shock and the low return temps which will also highten your fuel effy during low temp periods Spring months and such.

But with the Tekmare controls you can program your boiler to cut out at 160 to 150 during those periods. You won't need that much heat going to your loops at that period so your primary loop warms up your secondary loops over a period of time. The injection loop will run for a long period injecting short spurts as needed.

I just don't see the advantage until many years have passed.

I guess I like what the Europeans have done technically but I still like to "Buy American". And you can do the same thing with "our boilers"

Take a look at the domestic mid 84% + effy boilers and do the math and you will see what I am talking about. It is all in the system not the boiler.

Now if it is Aesthetics you are worried about than the Europeans have us beat hands down. But if you are looking to get the best bang for your buck take a minute and do some research.

Best of luck to you!




If

J.C.A._3

Viessman burner....

With their boiler would be my choice if money isn't a big problem. I like them, personally. They perform well and are as quiet as anything on the market with 1 exception I've found. The Buderus 215/315 with the Beckett burner is about the quietest I've heard to date. I had to put my hand on it to see if it was running.(a little big for your application and I haven't seen the 115/Beckett combo....YET)

All boiler/burner configurations have their +'s and -'s. It all depends on what you or the installer is the most comfortable with. Unless he's got a bond with the Viessman burner, he's not going to have parts on hand for repair. If they /you use an American burner , the parts are pretty much available with a phone call , if you haven't got them. Most suppliers of higher end equipment now have a fairly good stock of Riello parts, but the technician has to be comfortable working with them, or they tend to "change parts" till it's fixed.

Unfortunately, this is what I would base my decision on. Quick repairs or waiting for too long to get repairs finished.With the weather we've been having lately, I think the choice is a bit more biased than it would be in ...say, June. Things break, that's a fact. Getting it back up and running isn't something to be waiting for. Your choice. Keep us informed. I'd like to know what decision you made. Chris

Rochoc

Oil:
1) Buderus with Ecomatic Control w/ Riello Burner
2) Pensotti w/Riello Burner & Taco Controls, injection mixing control PC-705 , boiler reset PC-700, Taco switching relays.

Gas:
1) Munchkin

steve_26

great boiler

Viessmann;Gas, first choice Vitodens then Vitola gas power or oil,Vitorond and Buderus.

steve

Steve Ebels

In my own house

I have a Vitola, natural gas Viessmann chassis burner and the Vitotronic 200 control. The system consists of about 500 sq ft of climate panel running at low temp, one zone of baseboard and the rest of the home is heated with panel rads. The low temp floor runs through a Divicon which took all of about 15 minutes to pipe and wire. It's the slickest low temp setup I have ever installed. There are only 2 heating pumps, the main heating pump and the pump on the Divicon, with a seperate pump for domestic hot water. I think this system will outlast the house let alone myself. The minimum efficiency that I've seen with an analyzer is 85%+ a couple tenths. It usually is in the high 86% range.

As of yet this winter water temps has yet to pass 160* with temps as low as -13*.

Mark Wolff

Callbacks

You know, callbacks don't really count as "busy with work". Why are you messing with S2's when there are real boilers out there?

Mark Wolff

Can you say 90% + efficiency on #2 fuel oil?

Burnham Opus series. The 01, O2 and O3. Check it out at http://www.aboutopus.com

Sorry, but I am beyond enamoured with them. The only downside to them is their weight. They have the controls built in, they have pri/sec boiler warmup piping to protect it, they even have a MUFFLER for the thing.

With #2 oil they have an AFUE of over 90% on all three models. I think the bar was just raised.

ScottMP

We installed

A Viessmann last summer and Chris had to LOWER the efficiency of the boiler because the stack temperature was to low for the chimney !

How many times have you had to do that ?

We install Viessmann, Buderus, and Munchkin. First time we had to lower the efficiency

Scott

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Chris Sweatt

Buderus

Jon I just sent you an E mail I just got done building my second new house and I like the Buderus. I put in a lot of Buderus boilers for the company I work for. Was very impressed with the Beckett afg.Just opened the door the other day and the head was spotless. I put in a G115-4 runs great A lot better than a Riello, more user friendly. Like you I put in a lot of radiant w p/s pumping, I am a beliver in that.Read my E mail as I am in Maine