Gorton application and opinion

Dave_23

I have a Trane system with three Gorton #2's installed on the end of each of the two main returns and condensate return. The #2's are located near the ceiling above the boiler (see picture). The ambient temperature is probably 110 degrees F during the heating cycle, and I'm sure the iron piping is at least this hot, long after the end of a heating cycle. Given my environment, would Hoffman #75's be a better choice as main vents, even though they don't vent as fast as Gorton #2's? My concern is that the Gorton #2's may never open, once the room and piping get hot. Comments?

Fred Harwood

vents and temps

110 degrees is not too high for a Gorton, expecially on a return. On a main, however, the temperature can be too high, if the vent is mounted too close to the hot iron. I've had success by using black-iron 6-inch stubs to help thermally isolate the vent from the main and help ensure reopening on each cycle.

Mad Dog

Just get them up as high as you can on nipples

Mad Dog

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Dave_23

High up

I only have about 6 inches of room, so the vent is on top of a 3 inch nipple. It's all I have to work with. Comments?

Dale

Air goe sideways

Looking at your picture I woud go up as far as possible then sideways a foot or so and then up if those are joist spaces, if not just getting away to the side of that vertical should reduce the temp.

[Deleted User]

funny this posting should come up..

i recently had a problem where by the boiler would run from a cold start, coming out of setback, for about 40 minutes, then suddenly short cycle like crazy..what was happening was the return mains vents were closing due to the close proximity of the 4'' steam main..plus the vents were over the boiler in the ceiling next to the wall which provided next to no air movement..the darn things would not reopen,,it was just too hot..and there was no steam in the returns..i contacted ken at gorton, as was recommended by steamhead..gorton said that the bimetal STARTS to close at 110 degrees..and it can be ambiant..the bimetal element doesn't care if its inside steam or outside heated air that is heating up the casing..bottom line- we put two hoffman 75's in the boiler room and moved the gortons farther back up the dry return about 10 feet into the next room whose ambiant temperature is about 70 degrees..gorton said if the boiler room is excessively hot, or radiant heat off the steam main heats the returns air vent, then dont put it there..they recommended it be moved out of the boiler room..remember, it doesn't have to be 18 inches from the end of the main to work,,it can be seven feet from the returns end and still work..

[Deleted User]

heres a copy of the letter i sent gorton

Hello, my name is Gerry Gill and I am a plumber who uses your Gorton #2 main air vents extensively. I have recently run into a problem though on a job and would like your input on it. I have attached four pictures to help you follow along with my description.

Background is- we installed a new boiler on a two-pipe system. The original main vent was a single Hoffman 75 vent in the boiler room atop the end of the return piping. We replaced this vent when we put in the new boiler. We put four Gorton #2 main vents on a manifold for what we had hoped for would be major serious venting. This is pictured in attachments ‘’gorton2manifold’’ and ‘’gortonandceiling’’. Now, what was happening was the boiler would be able to run for about 45 minutes on a cold start then would short cycle like a mad dog for the rest of the day…

Okay, this is what we figured out..We removed an air vent after the boiler started short cycling and two things we noticed…the boiler stopped short cycling, and we could not blow thru the main vent..we removed all four and all four were shut. All four would also not reopen till they were down away from the ceiling. Now, keep in mind there was no steam in the return cause we had open pipes up there now..no visible steam at all…

Here is my theory, - the outside casing of the air vents was getting hot from two sources, first a hot water pipe that is at 130 degrees and on constant recirculation, and being right next to the steam piping itself..the air vents are next to the wall and the ceiling where air movement is probably slim at best..I felt the air vents were becoming hot enough from radiant heat and conduction to shut off, causing the boiler to cycle..

The fix- In the boiler room we replaced the rack of Gorton #2 air vents with two Hoffman 75 main vents (attachment titled Hoffman 75) and moved two Gorton#2 main vents about 10 feet away into another room where the ambient temperature is around 70 degrees, this is attachment ‘’gorton in laundry’’. The system works great now…

I conducted a rudimentary experiment with a contact thermometer (steam trap tester) and a hot air gun on a Gorton #1 vent when I got home. I found that heating the outside casing to around 130 degrees caused the air vent to close and it would not reopen till the outside temp of the casing was around 100 degrees.

My question are-
Why did the Hoffman vents work where yours didn’t?
Are there some requirements we should be following in keeping the outside shell of the main vents somewhat cool?
What is the temperature on the outside that the main vents cannot exceed?

We like your vents and will continue to use them but would like to learn more about the operating parameters of the main vents so we can apply them to the appropriate place without wasting lots of time, which is money.

Thank you- gerry gill


by the way- Gorton was really nice to deal with over this problem, and i learned alot from our conversations..and the #2 gorton is still the way to go, just pay attention to its surroundings..can something, even radiant heat from the steam main,heat it to 110 degrees? if so move it..

Unknown

I took two #2s over to Mad Dog's house this summer

When it was HOT out. They were in my car a while, before I brought them inside.

They were closed hard. We couldn't get anything through them. They were SHUT!!

Worked fine in the winter, though.

Noel

Steamhead

You might try

painting the #2 vents white. They would probably absorb less radiant heat that way.

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