A is there any source

Mike T., Swampeast MO

Complex answers.

That's a country-wide statistic and we do live in a BIG country. If you notice, the percentage increases with heating degree days.

This is though an EXISTING structure statistic. Heating systems in NEW single-family homes are below:

http://www.census.gov/const/C25Ann/sftotalheatsystem.pdf

Northeast area has the longest history with and greatest concentation of hydronic systems. Even there, however, the percentage appears to be dropping. Air cooling systems are much more common in the Northeast than in years past. The decline seems to correspond quite well with the increase in A/C. While the correlation seems apparent, actually determining causality is EXTREMELY difficult.

Cost is definitely a major factor but marketing has MUCH to do with perceived value. Other industries have managed to sell extravagantly expensive items on their perceived value. A lot of this has come from "home shows" on TV where glitz and glamor take first stage--WAY above the things we take for granted like heating.

The forced air people are able to showcase "whole house" air cleaning apparatus even if their actual usefulness is somewhat dubious. They show zoning--once the near exclusive province of hydronics--even if it is still limited in effectiveness and longevity.

The yellow and black sticker on every home appliance shows consumers that forced air equipment is wonderfully efficient--often just as or even more efficient than the most advanced boilers but at significantly less cost.

While it might be possible to design and install a forced air system that actually achieves this number, it is not a common occurrence. They will still work, with reasonable comfort, but not nearly as efficiently as that "number" leads consumers to believe. Hydronic systems, on the other hand, seem unfairly penalized for the very things that make them superior!

Speculative builders, faced with the "wants" of consumers that frequently outweigh their ability to afford have no choice but to use the least expensive mechanicals possible. If they don't their homes will be many thousands more (or significantly smaller) than "similar" homes on the market.

At least in my area, the era of smaller, stylish, well-built homes is LONG gone. Funny though that these STILL command the best resale value in town...

Custom builders may be relucant to recommend hydronics for fear of being "bogged down" by a sub with whom they do not frequently work and fearful of being held responsible for problems they know won't happen with their regular forced air sub.

Hydronics seems to involve more of an "art" than forced air. Such is both good and bad.

I designed my first forced air system (primarily for A/C) with nothing more than a sizing worksheet published in Consumer Reports! Granted, I had a bit of working knowledge from previously helping an APPRENTICE, but really nothing more. The system works exactly as designed, down to the intentional 2°-3° differential in a room that came back to haunt me when usage plans changed! What troubled me more than anything was that I couldn't find anyone to make the nice, sleek, curving ductwork that I see frequently in older homes and specified myself. I had to settle for the crappy, angular, crude and leaky things that I seen in every new home around here. (At least I did my best to seal and insulate WELL.)

My bookshelves are crammed with information on hydronics. I've studied them well yet still have MUCH more to learn than I already know.

The hydronic "artists" out there who have taken the time to study, have intense pride in their work and take the time to look back on their own previous jobs will likely never want for work and need little more than "word of mouth" for advertisement. Unfortunately, the areas they cover are likely to be quite small.

Two problems with hydronic "art" however.

The possible media are extremely wide in range and no one is suitable to every situation. "Art" is made by artists. Artists tend to be temperamental and once they have found a media and style that works well, there is a tendency to close their mind to other media and styles...

Those so well trained in a particular media as to turn hydronics into a craft sometimes find themselves bewildered by change and refuse to adapt...

George_10

How many homes in the US

have steam or hot water heat. I sure would like to find out this statistic. If any one knows a source, I would appreciate receiving the info.

Mike T., Swampeast MO

In 1997 about 12.5 million dwellings out of 101.5 million total were heated with hot water or steam. (Approximately 12%). This include single-family and multi-family dwelling units.

Source: 1997 Residential Energy Consumption Survey

ftp://ftp.eia.doe.gov/pub/consumption/residential/hc_tables/spaceheat_household.pdf

---------------------------------

LOTS of statistics at:

http://www.eia.doe.gov/fueloverview.html

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If you look up new housing start statistics you'll find that the proportion of new single-family residences with hydronic heat is on the decline.

George_10

Thanks exactly what I needed.

Is there any question you guys do not know the answer to?

Tim Gardner

why so small a percent wet?

I thought water (no disrespect to steam intended) was considered the best method of heating. Why is water and steam only used 12% of the time. Is scorched air so much cheaper? Easier? I don't get it.

bigugh_4

Marketing!

We wetheads simply do NOT market the product! Like dishwashers, Toilet room accessories, water softeners, (water conditioning equipment) amd so many other former appliances, we simply as a trade only market our services, not products. So the products are being marketed by others. Schorched air is less expensive and less comfortable, we know that. As a trade what are we doing to change those concepts? I think whole house perfabrication of wet heat is able to be preformed. lowering the cost of in the field installation. Steam and hydronic heat must be so to the public! we cannot sit and wait for them to come to us, since cheap heat is always there in the air!

hr

By a show of hands

how many folks here have never heard of, or seen, Dave Lennox. Or Lennox ads on TV, radio, billboards, or sides of trucks in every major city?

Enough said.

Ask those folks what name comes to mind when you mention radiant heat?

It's called a SNAP survey. Radiant manufactures should invest in some!

My wife has them done them for plumbing companies name reconition in various cities. Interesting info comes from those studies

hot rod

To Learn More About This Professional, Click Here to Visit Their Ad in "Find A Contractor"

Tim Gardner

Very interesting. I think I understand now. Thanks for the in depth explanation.

Greg Swob

I recall reading that

New Mexico has the highest per capita new installs of hydronic in the US. If true, what are they doing there that we are not? Are citizens of N.M. just that much smarter than those elsewhere? Or are our N.M. counterparts simply better at promoting their good work and a better mousetrap called hydronic heating?

I have spoken with area designers, builders, architects trying to promote the concept. Many seem to understand and agree with the basic advantages, but all state the same major roadblock - install costs. Even showing longer term operational cost advantages haven't moved many of the roadblocks separating scorched systems from hydronic. And pure comfort is a conceptual notion - those who have it or grew up with hot water heating in any form like it. Still, we will keep on talking the talk and ask those who are willing to be ultimately comfortable to permit us to use their testimonials. Greg

Mark Wolff

Wet Heat

Alaska has got to be one of the biggest wet heat locales in the nation. The only forced air we see is in mobile homes. Try getting forced air to keep a house warm at
-40* or worse.

Steve Eayrs

I agree Alaska is for boilers. I would say at least 90% of new resdentual and small commercial is wet, in this area. I am sure that not having a big need for cooling has helped that some. Peple love radiant up here.

Steve