HELP!? Oil Burner problem

steve_26

Adam, I work with both oil and gas ,if this is your first do yourself and your customer a big favor let this one go and call a trained oil burner tech...Then go take a oil course and get your Ticket...Steve

adambuild

Oil burner trips off

Hey guys! First and foremost, Happy Holidays to all the Wallies! I've given and I've gotten! Thanks to all I've gotten from and you're welcome to all I've given to! May all enjoy a happy, healthy, and prosperous New Year.

Now for the problem. We don't really service any oil heat clients but just picked one up. In addition to calling us to tune up their steam boiler, they just developed a problem where the oil burner "trips" and needs to be manually reset. Anyone have a list of any preliminary things I can look for? Thanks in advance.

Adam

adambuild

Bill Nye

More specific?

What trips ? The circuit breaker? The stack relay, the high limit, the motor thermal overload switch? The primary control , cad cell ?

It is a SAFETY control, not a nuisance thing. It means for some reason the flame is not just right.

Has it been serviced? Is it an oil problem ? soot and smoke problem? Ignition problem?

Look I don't mean to flame you, but oil burners are not really a hobby or something you have to do. If you are not comfortable with get some one that does it. Oil burners can not be serviced over the phone or internet.

If I could see it I would help you.

John@Reliable_5

Tune up & by the way it's locking out!

Sounds like a service call first. As Bill said really hard from here, that said,the #1 place to start is talking to the customer, they will tell you allot with-out even knowing it, it's your job to use that information.Then fuel system should be checked,serviced. That includes changing filters,strainer,nozzle(proper one from book) pump psi and vacuum,cut-off and coupling. Checking transformer & electrodes, then control systems.I think you can see where this is going. Hope this helps John@Reliable

Dave_16

I'd say

change the primary control, if it's a R 8148, or in the family, there may also be a dead spot in the burner motor, the next time out tap the primary a few times with your screwdriver or lineman pliers and see if it trips....if it does there's your problem. Does the burner start right away when they hit the reset?

Mark Wolff

??????

Yah, and while you're at it dance a little jig to the oil burner gods and sprinkle fairy dust on it too! Give me a break, its not some ethereal vague unknown that requires changing parts at random, it can easily be diagnosed (by a COMPETENT heating PROFESSIONAL and repaired, probably without EVER replacing the primary control. Where'd you go to school?

Adam, ignore that post and listen to John@Reliable, or people like that(professionals).

jim lockard

I only touched oil twice adam

and both times I wished I had not, any time I need oil work done I have a very good oil man I can call. moral of story leave oil to oil guys-J. Lockard

John Abbott

Amen....

With no disrespect to anyone oilburner service should only be performed by trained experienced people with the proper equipment.Having said that I don't mean that I or anyone else know it all and are above seeking answers on the wall but not entry level training.


John

Dave_16

I resent your comment !

I am more then a trained professional, and with what little was said, I simply stated what my experiences have been the past 28 yrs, so take your fairy dust and snort it! I ain't no parts changer but I'm also not on the job in question. I did'nt see you coming up with any helpful answers! I work with oil everyday, and my call backs are next to nil, if you'd like to check that fact email me and I'll give you my companies name and phone#. Start dancin the jig

Ted_8

Short list

A service call is for the most part fairly straight forward. Curve balls can happen but are rare.
Step #1 = got fuel to the nozzle. Stick the tank, read the gage, whatever else you can do to verify fuel availability. Check the fuel flow at the pump bleeder or remove the nozzle line and let it run into a can. If there is no flow check the filter, pump strainer, and pump coupling. If there is flow check the nozzle as it is the last piece in the puzzle on the fuel side.

Step #2 = got spark. Is the transformer good? Are the ignitors in good shape(clean, no cracks, ends not carboned over or burned off? Are they properly set?

Step #3 = check that the cad cell is clean and button it up for a test run. It should fire. If it fires but still locks out then it is time for a new primary control or cad cell. If it does not fire it could be, exces air, excess draft over the fire, ????? Here come the curve balls.

Good Luck & let us know what happens.


Ted

bob young

oil is not a hobby

truer words were never spoken. when we install a new oil-fired boiler we always have the oil mechanic set it up and do the start up.forty + years in the plumbing business but i know where to draw the line. to each his own.

Mark Wolff

Parts, Parts, Parts

If you look at the next posting by Ted, you will see the most commonly checked items on a boiler tripped call. First the fuel, is the tank empty? If it has fuel, is there fuel being pumped, is the filter or nozzle plugged? While you are at it, check for water in the fuel, another big flame failure cause. Next, check to verify the electrodes are properly spaced, and while you're at it check the transformer output. Then and only then would you look at the primary control as a possible cause for the trip outs.

From the initial question about a boiler that keeps tripping out, your response to automatically look at replacing the primary control I feel was not only unhelpful to the homeowner, but could have possibly steered him in a completely wrong direction, and had he pursued trying to figure it out on his own, might have even ruined perfectly good parts by crossing wires wrong, etc.

Perhaps my sarcastic comment was rather strongly stated, but your answer was so far out of the norm that I didn't want the homeowner to mistake that for a normal first check item. I can count more empty fuel tanks than broken primary controls 5 to 1 in my experience. For homeowners start with the basics.

Dave_16

I agree to a point

First let me say That i thoght the post was from a contractor I had ASSUMED ( ASSUME ...AN **** OUT OF U AND ME) that all that would have been checked first, even from a non oil guy.Forget oil pressures and all that, especially if the burner fires as soon as the primary is reset. It takes me forever to type so I could'nt possibly put evrything to look for in the post, it would've taken me hours! Yes I may have made it seem too simple, without knowing all the info, and I could've put the link to beckett on how to check the motor. The first thing I do is check for oil, test the transformer, pull the nozzzle asembly, change nozzle and filter...depending on the last tune up date, and another big culprit which is often over looked is the pump screen. What I was getting at about tapping the primary was if a slight tap trips the primary the contacts arent clean and it needs to be replaced, I've had many a system that would run a cycle and as soon as it was satisfied...watching with my own eyes ... as soon as it shut down the reset would trip......bad contacts, relaced primary all OK, there wa not enough info and I was judt trying to help a guy in need. Before you make condescending comments you should know who you're talking to, because if I could have I would have reached through the computer and pummeled you, and your sarcasm bothered me for days. I'd like to know what the fix was. Merry Christmas my friend and the best to you and yours.
Sincerely, frank sev

Mark Wolff

Sorry

Sorry for upsetting you, I really didn't mean to. I know what you mean about the primary controls going bad like that. Also, watch out for the fuel pump solenoid doing the same thing; two days ago we had a new (6 month old install) Beckett AFG burner on a Weil-McLain Gold Oil do the same thing. It wouldn't work until you tapped it with a screwdriver, then it was fine. The needle was sticking and needed to be replaced.

Once again, I'm sorry and I will try to watch the sarcasm, it wasn't needed, and I can see it didn't help. Merry Christmas to you too.

Mark

jackchips_2

It was disturbing,

at first, to see how this thread was progressing. Your initial comments had raised my temp a little, also Mark. I found your advice very elightening but the method, well---.

You both have proved your real gentlemen by the way you have resolved your little squabble. It just shows that by letting threads evolve between mechanics, professionals, amatuers and the like, we can all learn.

Merry Christmas to Mark, frank and all.

Leo

The internet

The beauty of the internet is, without voice inflection and body language, much of what is said is taken out of context.

Leo