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Please help estimating gas bill... JohnNY
Einsiedler
Member Posts: 61
open to corrections from those more in the know...
40 ft of FIN, assuming 800btu/ft @ 190F E.W.T. + 24 Hour operation. (highly unlikley, shouldn't degree days come into formula?)
800 btu/hr x 24 hours = 768,000 btu/day
100,000 btu = 1 therm
7.68 Therms per day @ $0.67 per therm = $5.14 per Day or $156.34 Monthly (extrapulated over 12 months)
How close was I ??, come on wallys.
EIN
40 ft of FIN, assuming 800btu/ft @ 190F E.W.T. + 24 Hour operation. (highly unlikley, shouldn't degree days come into formula?)
800 btu/hr x 24 hours = 768,000 btu/day
100,000 btu = 1 therm
7.68 Therms per day @ $0.67 per therm = $5.14 per Day or $156.34 Monthly (extrapulated over 12 months)
How close was I ??, come on wallys.
EIN
0
Comments

Please help estimating gas bill... JohnNY
My customer is in an apartment over a restaurant sharing a gas bill. The lanlord wants him to pay for gas in the winter without adding a meter.
The apartment has 40' of fintube installed. The boiler runs at about 190f. The utility charges $0.67 per therm. Assume the boiler never shuts off.
Can someone help me with a formula?
Thank you, in advance.
P.S. It was much warmer in the Carribean last week.
JohnNY
To Learn More About This Professional, Click Here to Visit Their Ad in "Find A Contractor"Contact John "JohnNY" Cataneo, NYC Master Plumber, Lic 1784
Consulting & Troubleshooting
Heating in NYC or NJ.
Classes0 
what's the firing rate
of the boiler in hundred cubic feet/hour?
1 Therm, by definition = 100,000 BTU Assume the boiler runs 24 hrs a day (your assumption) divide the input rate in BTU/hr by 100,000 BTU/therm, giving you the firing rate in Therms/hr. Multiply this by the number of hours it runs to get the cost of the gas used.
for a 60,000 BTU/hr input boiler run continuously for a 30 day billing period: (60,000 BTU/hr)/(100,000 BTU/Therm) = 0.6 Therms/hr. (30 days)*(24 hrs/day)= 720 hours, so (720 hours)*(0.6 Therms/hr)=432 Therms. Since a Therm costs $0.67 the cost is (432 Therms)*($0.67/Therm)=$289.44 for the 30 day billing period.
Two observations:
1. the gas is dirt cheap where he lives (assuming US dollars)
2. Clearly the boiler doesn't run 24 hours/day  if you had a time meter on it you could meter it that way. Say it averaged 16 hours a day that month. then the time would be (16hrs/24hrs)*(720 hours/billing period)=480 running hours and the bill becomes (480hrs)*(0.6 therms/hr)*($0.67/Therm)=$192.96
0 
so you figure
32,000 BTU input (and 32,000 output, for 100% efficiency), but say we call it 80% efficiency, then input is 40,000 BTU/hr and bill is $192.75 for a 30 day billing period.
I'm quessing he planned to divide the result by the actual boiler on percentage, as it wouldn't run continuously in the real world.
Very close to my guess of a 60,000 BTU input boiler running 2/3'rds duty cycle  but that is just coinidence.0 
Why...
won't the LL allow a gas meter? Sounds like he plans on making money off the enrgy, which is illegal unless you're registered as a "utility purveyor".
Gas meters are around $150.00.
ME0 
It has to be a legal 2family....
It has to be a legal 2family, which it is not....
Then we would need another boiler.....
This, believe it or not, is common practice 'round these parts.
To Learn More About This Professional, Click Here to Visit Their Ad in "Find A Contractor"Contact John "JohnNY" Cataneo, NYC Master Plumber, Lic 1784
Consulting & Troubleshooting
Heating in NYC or NJ.
Classes0 
BTU Meter
What about using a btu meter?
Never used one but I might considder it in this application.
Link:
http://www.isteccorp.com/5607.htm
There are other manufacturers. Try doing a search.
All the best,
Robert0 
I think
NYC averages 2000 hours/year of operation. The warm floor may throw this off some. In WNY, we figure 2600. Although actual usage seems to be lower for most. That's about 7000 degree days. I have a formula for degdays but can't find it as my computerized heatloss program figures usage ESTIMATES for me now. Nice feature on an inexpensive program0
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