Oil Consumption?

Warmfoot

My good friend just called me and informed me that he had just refilled his oil tank (He ran it dry). I installed a radiant system in a thin slab, Buderus Side vent boiler, 4-way mix 7 DHW controlled by a Tekmar 363 In five months, he went through 440 gallons of fuel oil for his 2200 square ft house. He keeps the temp at about 73 degrees. (He has two young uns that like to be almost naked all the time!!))

Now the whole point of this post.....My friends neighbor, who built a house at the same time had their Radiant Floor system installed by one of my not-so-experienced competitors. (I guess that really wouldn't make him a competitor?) This house is about 200 square feet bigger. In the last 7 weeks, they have used over 500-gallons of fuel oil. I am waiting for a call from the neighbor to come figure out why he is going through so much fuel. These kind of stories make me feel like I am on the right track and confirm that I am doing the things.

Do you guys hear similiar stories at all??

Ernie Bogue

Master Hydronics LLC

www.warmfeetusa.com



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PJO_5

Comparing Apples to Oranges...

I have several people comparing their usage of oil to mine, but none of them have radiant (as I do), as well as passive solar so it's not fair I guess...

My bills for heat and hot water are about 40% less on average, and I also keep my house much warmer...the first floor is 73F and the upstairs is 69 and 72 in the two zones respectively (upstairs is baseboard).

I do believe the method of installation and the proper controls make a big difference from what the Wall has shown me, so IMHO you're right in your thinking.

Take Care, PJO

Steve McCarthy

apples, oranges or pears

Where oil use is concerned, I think, in cases of normal houses(2000-3000sq.ft.)controls have a small effect on consumption. More important is the burner and how carefully it is tuned. I see a lot of low end newer burners and still
see old non flame retention burners that have never even seen a smoke pump much less a combustion analyser or draft gauge.
By far, the factor that impacts the fuel use the MOST is the heat loss rate of the house. I use a blower door to measure the tightness of houses and I never cease to be surprised at how leaky some houses are. You can't tell by just looking. Much of the time the air leakage is affecting the performance of the insulation.
I think a tight, well insulated house with some simple mechanical ventilation and a boiler, ANY BOILER, that is tuned will have low fuel consumption. The sexy controls I would leave behind. I would pay extra for a sidewall vented Riello
Steve / Starbright Energy Services

Steve Eayrs

I say bananas........

You can't tell me that good controls, I/O reset, and the like don't make a difference. I have seen way to many before and after systems, that saved 10 or better, with controls, w/ no changes in the burner settings.
One that comes to mind is a 16-plex apartment building that saved 15%. Comparisons were with the gallons per year, averaged over 10 years before and about 3 years after. Used Tekmar controls, lead/lag fired the boilers, outdoor reset, I/0 injection pump all the baseboards zones.
Total cost recovery in about 2-1/2 years.

Steve

Steve McCarthy

grapes

The more complex the building, the more controls will have an affect. And the cost!! Consider the cost of trying to retrofit an apartment building with insulation and trying to make it tighter. Very expensive compared to installing control(s) on a central heating plant. BUT....I work mostly on single family residences. If you install good quality bare bones equipment in a house that is tight and well insulated and measure consumption and then retrofit more complex controls, you will barely see a blip in the consumption rate. I will admit that I don't see very many tight, well insulated houses out there.
By 10 I asume you mean 10%. I use 325 gallons per year for heat and hot water in a 7500 DD climate. Saving me ten puts say $40 in my pocket and I doubt that if you installed a reset at my place, you would get 10%. Maybe 3-5%. Now go to a big or medium apartment building and take 3%-5% or 10% of $15,000-20,000. Big savings. You would be considered a hero. In normal residential situations, advanced controls make some homeowners and installers "feel good" like "I have NASA technology in MY basement, WOW". But it has little or no afect on the fuel bill. I still am of the opinion that for little buildings, Insulation and air sealing are the appropriate technology. For big buildings, controls are Very cost effective.( and it would be nice if they also were insulated and had controlled ventilation)

Boilerpro_3

It has alot to do with the house and system

If you have a convection heating system (which by it's nature increases air leakage), with an oversized boiler, in a leaky house and you put reset controls on it, you'll see some big savings. You just made a big dent in the hot air stratification, cutting air leakage and conduction through the ceilings and upper portions of the wall. Also, if you have a zoned system, reset controls make alot of sense, since every time only one or a few zones are running the boiler is oversized, causing rapid temp swings in the system and unstable air temps.
Now if you have a single zone converted gravity system with a properly sized boiler, reset controls will have little effect. Typically you only see a 15 to 20F water temp change on each boiler firing cycle (about 1.5 cycles per hour) on a typical winter day, so hot air stratificatin is limited already by the mass of the system. In addition, you have a high percentage of radiant heat, so this further dcreases air leakage.
From a mix of experience and opinion.

As is the answer to most questions, It Depends!

Boilerpro