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Over sized boiler

Wayco Wayne
Wayco Wayne Member Posts: 615
I just got an E-mail from him and after giving him several doses of reality, (mainly how much joist plates can add up to, not to mention gyp crete) he is re-thinking his dream of total radiant floors. He is thinking hydro air, and maybe one or 2 selected spaces for radiant floor. Not the dream but you do what you can afford. WW

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Comments

  • Wayco Wayne
    Wayco Wayne Member Posts: 615
    Looked at a job

    where the Homeowner had a plumber begin a radiant floor install but bailed on him before he got too far. There was a boiler in the basement left uncrated but uninstalled from this initial endeavor. A cast iron beastie made by W/M and rated at 300,000 btu input. I measured and went home and did a heat load. It came out to 60,000 btu's needed. I called the HO and told him. He was not too happy. I am recommending an 80,000 Munchkin to take it's place. He's going to try and return it to the supply house. I thought it would make a great garden centerpiece. :) WW

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  • heatboy
    heatboy Member Posts: 1,468
    Boiler sizing.

    Apparently, the plumber didn't realize that when you size a boiler by the finger method, you are supposed to stand across the street on the curb, not the front steps. Betcha', that even with a 300MBH boiler his prices were still cheaper than yours, right?

    hb

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    heatboy



    The Radiant Whisperer





    "The laws of physics will outweigh the laws of ecomomics every time."
  • Tom Meyer
    Tom Meyer Member Posts: 300
    The Days of \"Bigger is better\" are long gone

    Doing an heat loss is critical to boiler replacement but I wonder how many people actually know how to do them? And I wonder how much information on retrofits is readily available to do an actual heat loss.

    Then you've got the old (and extremely outdated) philosophy of "I figure out what I need and add 25% because I've never beeen called back for having an oversized boiler."

    Fuel used to be cheap, and in the old days this was "acceptable". We're not doing the customer or the industry any favors when we oversize a boiler.

    The Radiant Panel Association Standard Guidelines states:

    "The boiler net output should be within the range of 100% to 120% of the calculated heat loss unless design factors, pipe losses or boiler ratings require that the boiler selection exceed this range."

    Senior Designer/Trainer
    Precision Hydronics Corporation
    www.precisionhydronics.com
  • Mad Dog
    Mad Dog Member Posts: 2,595
    Hilarious!!!!!!!!! I hope the HO

    learned his lesson by hiring a real contractor this time. Hos like this will often become yoyur best customers - converts if you will Mad Dog

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  • Steve Ebels
    Steve Ebels Member Posts: 904
    At least your guy

    Listened to you the way it sounds. I had the same situation this winter. Heat loss of 58,000 or so, as I remember. The boiler had already been purchased by a friend who knew "somebody". It was a 180,000 btu Slant Fin and to top that off the place was divided into 9 zones, the largest being less than 9,000 btu load. The were/are hooking it up cold start and running the limit at 200*. The HO didn't go with my suggestions because he didn't want to offend his friends who were helping with the job.

    I did everything but get on my knees and beg the guy to reconsider but he wouldn't budge. What are you going to do in a case like that?
  • Mad Dog
    Mad Dog Member Posts: 2,595
  • flange
    flange Member Posts: 153


    if not returnable, is it for sale cheap??????????
  • Steve Ebels
    Steve Ebels Member Posts: 904
    I'm betting

    That I get a call about the end of next winter that will go something like this.

    HO: Steve, I'd like you to come and check out my boiler. I think something is wrong with it.

    Steve: Zat a fact. What seems to be the problem?

    HO: Well, I don't think it's running right. It goes off and on ALL the time. Sometimes it runs for only 15-20 seconds and it shuts off. A minute or two later it comes back on again. Now the exhaust blower is starting to make a funny noise too. It just doesn't seem like it's running the way it should.

    Steve: How long has it been doing this?

    HO: My wife said something about it last fall when it just started to get cold. You know, about the on/off thing. When it was real cold this past January and February it didn't seem to be quite as bad, but it still did it a lot. My buddy that got the boiler for me said his friend at the supply house told him that it was a high efficiency boiler. I'm wondering if that's the truth because my wife and I just figured out the propane bill for the winter and it came to over $3,000.

    Steve: Wow! That's a lot for a brand new home.

    HO: Yeah, that's what I thought too. I talked to Lars down the road at church. You remember him?

    Steve: Yep I remember him and the job I did for him.

    HO: Yeah, He said you put in a boiler for him 4 years ago, One of those Bludarees, Budrus or something like that. He said his fuel bill for he winter was only about $1,800 for that big old house he's got.

    Steve: He told me he was pretty pleased with how it was doing.

    HO: Our house always seems to be warm then cool, you know? Like it never stays the same temperature. Lars says his house feels like it has wood heat in it. Like it stays the same temperature all the time. I just don't think my boiler is working right.

    Steve: Well I'll be glad to see what I can do for you but I don't think there's much that can be changed without some major revamping of you system.

    HO: What do you mean? You haven't even looked at it. How do you know what needs to be done.

    Steve: Do you remember when you were building your home and I made some recommendations to you about the size of your boiler and a good control setup?

    HO: Kinda, but I don't see how that can make a difference like 1200 bucks and it sure wouldn't have anything to do with the boiler coming on and going off all the time would it?

    Steve: Hhhhhmmmnnnnn, Why don't I come over, say Tuesday afternnon and we'll see what we can find..........................
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