Did the fire kill them or CO poisoning?

Mark Hunt

like to see it John.

Mark H

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John R. Hall

Ohio State Fire

Five college kids killed in a house fire on Ohio State campus

John R. Hall

Ohio State Fire

Five college kids killed in a house fire on Ohio State campus.

"Authorities say the tentative cause of death was smoke inhalation and carbon monoxide poisoning, and a final ruling would be made when toxicology test results are in."

Isn't it true that some fire victims are misdiagnosed as victims of smoke inhalation when in fact, the CO from the burning materials killed them first? The building owner in this house said there were six working smoke detectors. Maybe thge kids were passed out from the CO and no alarm would have woke them up.

I'll be interested in toxicology and autopsy results.

Link:
http://start.earthlink.net/newsarticle?cat=6&aid=D7QE4I6O0_story

Tom Hughes

CO Inhalation

Similar incident nealry killed my family on Christmas Eve several years ago. My parents, gradparents and brother all went to sleep. In the middle of the night the old oil burning furnace's heat exchanger cracked and CO started to pump thru the ductwork all over the house. My mother woke up to go use the restroom and fell over. She got back up and nudged my father who was out cold. She barely got to the phone and called 911, gave them the address and passed out. When the fire dept got to the house everyone was passed out and the furnace closet had caught fire! They took all 6 of us in and gave us oxygen and we were all on our feet only hours later. YIPE!

BillW@honeywell

\"Fire\" deaths

Very few people killed in fires actually die from flame contact. Fires in today's building materials produce extremely toxic smoke containing not only CO & CO2 but vinyl chloride from burning plastics among many other chemical "bad actors" from our synthetic world. These synthetics also produce very dense, black smoke that is very high in particulates. Extremely nasty stuff. Virtually all fire departments require their firefighters to use scba equipment now.

rudy_2

Tragic

Three of the victims were from my town, Athens, where Ohio University is located. My oldest daughter is about the victims' ages... Can't imagine the grief the parents must be experiencing.

Read a State Fire Marshal study that estimated 75% of fire victims die from CO exposure not burns.

That's why, in my own home, I have 2 CO-Experts Low Level Monitors. My heating equipment gets checked at least monthly so I'm not concerned about them as a potential CO source. However, my entire house, including the rough cut siding, shingle roof and half the ceilings are wood. If the place ever catches fire, it will quickly be gone.

From what I've learned recently, smoke alarms have been 'dumbed down' over the years to eliminate 'false alarms'. Remember when they first came out? Just about anything (cooking, showering, etc) would set them off. That is not the case now. Now, apparently it takes a raging fire before they alarm and that may be to late.

I still have a couple of smoke alarms but I honestly don't trust them.

Good grief, I recently replaced mine - paid 10 bucks apiece - how much protection can I reasonably expect for 10 bucks!!!!

I know these low level CO monitors are not 'approved' for fire protection but common sense tells me they will provide much better protection for my family. JMHO

Unknown

Many deaths in fires

are from CO, it is often diagnosed as smoke inhalation.There are not usually autopsy's done unless foul play is suspected.

Another interesting fact is that many explosions that occur during fires are also CO it has a lower explosive limit of 12.5% and an upper explosive limit of 74% a very broad range. There are also usually extremely high levels of Hydrogen in burning areas. The movie "Backdraft" was a very good example of this.

Mark Hunt

CO experts


Here in New York it is now the law that ALL residences have CO alarms. WHy it took this long is beyond me.

That being said, I am now concerned about the quality of protection one can expect from low end CO monitors. All we need are a few "false" alarms and people will just unplug them. Now you have 0 protection.

And how many people know WHO to call in the event a CO alarm goes off? Fire department? Utility? Heating contractor? Plumber?

Will ANYONE from any of these choices be trained in finding the SOURCE and CAUSE of the high CO?

What if the CO is coming from the gas stove that was purchased from a big box store? Will the big box folks know what to do? Do they have emergency service for such a thing?

Most fire related deaths occur due to CO poisoning. There are often a whole slew of toxic gases in a fire that can and will kill you, but CO seems to get you first. The body absorbs it easier.

CO alarms will tell you that there is a problem but they won't tell you where or why the problem started. That is why we all need to be trained, HIGHLY trained!!

It's a matter of life and death.

Mark H

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Edward A. Carey

Smoke & CO detectors

Just a side note, last year at the change from DStime to standard time, we covered a topic about our smoke & CO detectors. We also covered a new device that I use in my own home, which is a water detector. They are great around the water heater, boiler AHU etc.

I just changed a LOT of batteries in my home when we changed our clocks. I change the batteries, good or bad.
I have a moderate size home, but I have 9 smoke detectors, 4 CO detectors, and 2 water sensor alarms.
I also sleep well at night knowing that I have that added protection.

In light of this topic, I just thought that I would throw it out as a reminder.

Regards to all,

& be safe

Edward A. (Ed) Carey

John R. Hall

CO Presentation

I recently put together a PowerPoint presentation on CO detection and prevention. I'd welcome a critique if anyone would like me to e-mail it to them.

Rock Solid Restoration_3

Fire sprinklers

Have any of you guys ever installed residential fire sprinklers.

I am renovating my house and I plan to install them.

Just wondering if anyone has had any experience with them.

Unknown

Send it on John

I will take a look at it.

BillW@honeywell

Mandatory CO detectors

New Jersey now requires CO monitors, too. If you pull a permit for ANY home renovation, when the inspector comes to sign off the job, he/she will also check for smoke & CO detectors. You also will be required to install them if you are selling your house. ANY new construction, they are required. No, there aren't any "CO Police", but common sense should prevail. If you don't have them, GET THEM NOW!

MURPH'

He'll show you his......

If you show him yours........Hmmmmm !!!

John R. Hall

Arson suspected

Police and fire department suspect arson. What happened to the good old days when fists were used to resolve a dispute? It's a real shame.

John R. Hall

Bounces back

Timmie:

I've tried sending it twice using your e-mail address as I always have but it bounces back.

Al D'Ambola

John would love to see it.

Unknown

John Hall

can you send me a copy through the mail?

Timmie McElwain
22 Griffith Drive
Riverside, Rhode Island 02915

If not then I am out of luck.

I had some blocks set up on my e-mail that will not let some things through. My computer company has supposdly removed them but I guess they are still there.

Earthfire

Residential sprinklers

If you are building new or doing a major remodel, its the perfect time to install residential sprinklers.Wirsbo has the AQUASAFE system. Its a patented combination potable water and fire supression system for residential applications.The installers are factory trained and certified. And I've installed it in an addition to my wife's house. When people visit they don't even notice it. If you are in eastern Pa. contact me' if not go to Wirsbo.com and check it out. After installing and living with The Aquasafe system I would not choose to use a traditional system in a residential application.

Mad Dog

Absolutely, Biil...That's why, I will not use PVC pipe

in my own home. When burned, it emits a heavier than air chlorine gas - so much for getting down and crawling below the smoke huH? Surviving a fire is hard enough! Mad Dog

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