In left field

Pete van der Meulen

I recently bought a 75 year old house here in Portland, OR, 3 stories on top of a full basement, where the primary loop is for the two-pipe steam heat system. I love the whole idea, and am doing all I can do as an architect yet lay person to learn about it and improve it. Had a filthy but operational original brick firebox, crusty steel fire-tube assembly, and oil-fired burner.

Too noisy and dirty, I replaced it all with a new Lennox gas-fired boiler; I hired a heating company that promised the world, but the installer had clearly never done one before, (he was nonetheless delightful, from Hawaii, had worked in a pineapple plantation boiler room) and I coached him mercilessly while reading the installers manual. Huge relief in the end, clean and quiet. I then inspected all of the radiators, freed-up the frozen valves, removed all of the air vents (installed by previous owners) from radiators, and pretty much reduced water hammer to nil by releveling radiators and the associated piping to all slope in the correct direction (4 stories, interesting effort)..

After replacing a failed-closed trap, all radiators now heat, all the way across. However, there is a vertical green vent on the condensate riser just above the boiler, that hisses quite loudly when the furnace is on, making me believe that perhaps there are other radiator traps stuck open in the system, pressuring the condensate piping. 10 radiators, all flavors, different brand traps...75 years old, I find them impossible to break open to check (I broke one already). Must I replace them all (replacement parts geometry a pipe-fitting nightmare)?

I'm already in over my head a bit, but it seems that steam systems are very uncommon in Portland, and despite many calls I cannot find anyone in the Portland area well heeled in steam systems to become a trusted service provider. Does anybody know someone who knows their stuff here?

Another question; Armstrong makes thermostatically controlled valves for radiators....are these a good idea, with the boiler controlled from the central thermostat? With lots of valves semi-closed, does that effectively make the boiler oversized? The boiler cycles on and off too frequently in my opinion; seems it may be related.

Thanks.

Unknown

Pete, lucky guy you...

Nice to see someone get bit by the steam bug. Keep the faith. YOU are the new steam guy in your area.

If a trap works properly, you can tell. The return piping beneath it stays warm, not 200 degrees.

The air vent is a simple thing, see if it is hot or cold when it hisses. It should close when the steam gets there.

If everything is sized right, it should be hard to hear the vent working.

Thermostatic Radiator valves are great on 2 pipe steam. The valves you have can be adjusted to taste anytime someone wants to.

Get Dan's book, "The Lost Art of Steam Heating". I can tell already that you like this stuff.

One steam system won't be enough for you. You need to think about the day that you get your system just the way you want it. Withdrawal can be treated.......

Noel

Steamhead

\"Withdrawal\"?

Never!! Once the steam bug bites- it stays with you.

Pete, that green vent on the dry (above the waterline) return is probably a Hoffman #75, which really doesn't have enough capacity for Vapor- that's why it hisses. It has to vent all the air coming into the dry return from the radiators (via the radiator traps) which is quite a lot. Some Vapor systems used radiator traps to vent air from the steam mains into the dry returns- if you see them there, that's what theyre doing. And the traps keep steam out of the dry return.

I'd use a Gorton #2 vent on that system. It has 4 times the capacity of the Hoffman #75 and should be much quieter. If it still hisses, add a second #2. You can contact Gorton at www.gorton-valves.com .

Have you been able to tell who made the equipment used on your Vapor system?

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Pete van der Meulen

Trapped

Wonderful-thanks so much for the response! I looked at it last night, and it is in fact a Hoffman #75. The hissing is not objectionable, as it is in the basement, it just made me wonder a bit. Do you think I should change it?

I guess it's the traps that mystify me most. Most appear original (Dunham Bush?), and likely have never been opened. I haven't placed a temperature gauge on the return piping at the radiators (past the trap), but they are too hot to touch, and seem to be the same temp as the radiators. I assume that at each radiator, they let the air through, and close when the steam hit, yet let the condensed water through. If they are stuck open, how does this affect the system?

Again, thanks-

tombig

Radiator Traps

I remember rebuilding Dunham Bush radiator traps years ago. They have screw out bellows assy. Somebody out there has parts. The hard part is finding who. Or just use replacements. Have fun with those spuds.