Hydraulic Separation?

Peregrine

Hello

If you could take a look at this near boiler piping please. I am confused by the intent of the designer in the connection between the outlet pipe and the return at the junction in the pictures. The junction looks like 2 T’s under that insulation; one on the outlet going up and one on the return going down. Is there pressure drop at the return down impacting the outlet up and vice versa? It does not look like any successful attempt at primary secondary piping.

Delta T's at the boiler are 3 at low fire and 20 at high fire.

Before I remove that junction and implement primary secondary under the boiler Please help.

IMG_4192.jpg

IMG_4193.jpg

IMG_4195.jpg

Thanks and have a great day.

hot_rod

a drawing of all the near boiler piping might help

Bummer about the Wilo with the motor upside down? They can be rotated in the housing.

Peregrine

its not pretty.

IMG_4197.jpg

the Wilo is upside down because the wall is right there on the right and it needs to accommodate the wiring.

Kaos

That is still technically separated, the T is just in a different orientation. Flow preference would be stright through the T, so it is not perfect but if your secondary has a decent pressure loss, it doesn't matter.

Why all the insulation, are you also cooling here?

pedmec

as @kaos said, its still technically separate. Just roll the tee so the branch is going to the boiler and you'll see it.

hot_rod

As long as there is a circulator on the system loop?

It breaks some of the "best practices" as far as distances before and after the tee "set" but the flow rates dictate what happens inside the pipes.

Screenshot 2024-12-15 at 11.22.25 AM.png

Peregrine

yes there is a circulator on the system loop

thanks and have a great day

Peregrine

hello again. if i could revisit the hydraulic separation question again. it is a mod/con combi boiler.

it looks like the the pictures and schematic i submitted indicated hydraulic separation even though it is somewhat unorthodox. the install manual calls for primary secondary or a low loss header. does the present hydraulic separation fulfill that requirement?

please see attached a primary secondary submittal provided by the manufacturer. should it be installed? would the union in the schematic and pictures have to removed? would it be worth the time and cost?

delta T is 3 at low fire and 20 at high fire.

Please help. thanks and have a great holidays.

Primary Secondary Submittal.pdf

hot_rod

What you have will work, it is not a "textbook" design, but serves the purpose.

Yes, primary secondary, low loss header and hydraulic separation, all accomplish the same function.

If you wanted to undertake a major repipe, I would suggest a hydraulic separator. It gives you four important functions in one "box"

Air, dirt, magnetic and hydraulic separation

Read about it here.

https://www.caleffi.com/sites/default/files/media/external-file/Idronics_15_NA_Separation%20in%20hydronic%20systems.pdf