Old Boiler needs replacing, suggestions on models, etc. (NEW ENGLAND)

JNE80

Hi, I need to replace my home's 30 year old Olympus boiler; it vents up the chimney. We live in Northern New England. The house is 2500 sq feet~ and has 3 zones and has hot water baseboards. It also has a BoilerMate of the same age that is leaking.

I'm looking to get a boiler that's built to last and save oil consumption (just like everyone else :D).

I've read that the Buderus G115ws is a great option and would pair a Reillo burner with it. Any other suggestions? I know that this is a tough question to answer but cost estimates?

We do want an indirect water heater source like the BoilerMate.

Edit: I had our boiler technician that's a friend of the family look at the boiler and said that it's on it's last leg, it could last a few more years or quit this winter.

Hot_water_fan

Sizing is very important, this should be step 1 https://www.greenbuildingadvisor.com/article/replacing-a-furnace-or-boiler

Cost is variable.

JNE80

@Hot_water_fan Cost is variable, but looking for ROUGH ideas, if possible.

I'm going to put some more thought to the article, however am not sure I will be able to calculate that 100% being that it's now summer and don't want to wait for Winter to have the boiler potentially fail.

Temps in January & February were the coldest, ranging from 0-20F. How much the boiler came on, honestly did not pay attention. 01/26/2024 filled up with 180.7 gallons and on 02/27/2024 filled up with 130.2 gallons. We keep the thermostats at 66 all the time during the cold season.

mattmia2

You could just replace the indirect then replace the boiler when the time comes in a year or 30. It depends on what condition the boiler is in currently.

Energy Kinetics has some more efficient oil boilers. Viessman also has more efficient oil boilers. With baseboard heat you are unlikely to get better efficiency with a gas mod con boiler so your emitters limit you to conventional boilers. You won't get enough of an efficiency improvement to justify replacing the boiler just for better efficiency.

JNE80

I had our boiler technician that's a friend of the family look at the boiler and said that it's on it's last leg, it could last a few more years or quit this winter. I don't feel that he is being dishonest. My goal is to not replace it just for efficiency's sake but for heat in the winter. :)

Hot_water_fan

You just need winter usage to get the heat loss, give it a go!

The site has rules about pricing. Maybe estimates are treated different, but TBD. It really does depend though, sorry to say. Roughly 4 figures to 5 figures.

JNE80

OK- didn't mean to break a rule, just an idea on cost forecasting. :)

Winter usage:

10/6/2023	123.6
12/11/2023	162.5
01/26/2024	180.7
02/27/2024	130.2
04/16/2024	153.7

Hot_water_fan

not bad! If you follow the articles instructions, I suspect you’ll be in the smallest oil boiler category. Not unsurprising.

JNE80

With that said, what are some models (maybe not specific BTU sizing) would you guys recommend? Maybe a top 2 or 3.

Hot_water_fan

I’d worry about finding a good installer then go with what they’re most comfortable with. You want parts, service, etc way more than brand.

JNE80

I agree. I have some calls out. Our boiler tech friend did suggest Peerless, Buderus. I think one local company likes System 2000 but there's such a mixed opinion on them. I was leaning towards Buderus but am not sure if it supports indirect hot water tank like a BoilerMate?

mattmia2

Virtually any hot water boiler will support an indirect. A few conventional boilers have the controls built in for an indirect, most will just use a zone controller with a priority zone to use an indirect with a conventional hot water boiler. Most mod con boilers have controls for an indirect built in.

Hot_water_fan

3 brands is a great place to start. It’s only June, get a good feel for the installers and then pick.

JNE80

In the mean time, what brands would you select if you were in my situation?

Hot_water_fan

It would be most productive to find the contractor first.

Steamhead

https://forum.heatinghelp.com/discussion/comment/1803918#Comment_1803918

This. @JNE80, go here:

https://heatinghelp.com/find-a-contractor/

SuperTech

If the installing contractor is good then you can't go wrong with the Energy Kinetics System 2000. That would be my top option. After that I would recommend a 3 pass boiler. Pure Pro Trio, Utica Tri Fire, Buderus or Viessman. I can't think of any good reason to install a single pass pin type boiler these days unless it's a matter of saving every penny on costs. Crown, Burnham, Peerless or Weil McLain are the most popular.

Any boiler can have an indirect tank. I'm not a fan of Amtrol Boilermates anymore. The older ones were a lot better than the new ones for some reason. The best indirect tank would probably depend on your water quality. Stainless, stone lined or glass lined usually are the differences with indirect tanks.

The quality of the installation determines the reliability and efficiency of the system. This all depends on how good the installing contractor is.

Greening

We had the Energy Kinetics System 2000 installed in a small house recently with Riello burner and a new basic stainless tank (not EK brand). All the heads and related plumbing were replaced. We replaced a 1940s system that was highly inefficient, so the benefits we saw were extreme.

EK system is very quiet and works perfectly. It has a small footprint.

Frankly, the biggest cost difference is warmer months when heating is not needed (hot water heating became very inexpensive). Winter oil bill is much lower, too. Our annual oil consumption dropped much more than 50% but you are not going to see such dramatic savings coming from a 1990s boiler.

Basement is much cooler in the summer, so air conditioning needs dropped massively saving electricity (since your boiler is not too old you won't see such a large benefit). Conversely, the basement is cooler in the winter but we are no longer indirectly paying to heat it.

Our Energy Kinetics system permits 4 zones + hot water, so we added 2 zones upstairs and just keep them at 60*F; that saves oil and is more comfortable for sleeping.

We ran a fresh-air intake. That makes things quieter and more efficient. Warm air is no longer being sucked out of the house and being sent up the chimney, so the house is (much) less drafty. Highly recommended.

We also replaced the tank.

EBEBRATT-Ed

As others have mentioned the installer is the key. What good is asking for a Buderus with a Reillo burner if the installer is not used to them or knows how to set them up properly?

EK, Buderus, Peerless, Weil McLain and most of the others mentioned are all good boilers.

If an installer is not comfortable installing a certain brand they you don't want that combination.

Your oil consumption is pretty low so your not going to reap tremendous savings no matter what you pick.

MikeL_2

Atmospheric boilers are not available in a wide range of sizes so they're btu output may only match the design conditions for a few days a year. And because atmospheric boilers are oversized most of the heating season I think the near boiler piping is as important as a heat loss calc.

At the minimum, pumping away should be a priority. And primary / secondary piping would be the ideal near boiler piping strategy.

mattmia2

https://forum.heatinghelp.com/discussion/comment/1804792#Comment_1804792

It sounds like you were running a tankless coil and a warm start boiler control. The warm start for the tankless coil was likely most of your cost.

JayMcCay

Thank you for considering Energy Kinetics boilers, @NJE80 , and for everyone’s comments. The below webpage chart compares heat and hot water boiler efficiency from a Department of Energy lab study – it shows that low mass with thermal purge (Energy Kinetics design) is even more efficient than modulating condensing designs. For the best savings, I’d recommend the hot water tank with our Sealix coated plate heat exchanger which optimizes thermal purge and allows the boiler to finish without heat left wasted in it. With indirect tanks with coils, the boiler will finish hot 3 to 5 times a day, every day a typical home is occupied and has normal hot water use. The Sealix coating has excellent performance in hard water applications, especially if a scale stopper is used. We do see some of the biggest savings upgrading from tankless coil boilers, and we also see very substantial savings upgrading from typical boilers with indirect tanks.

I’m happy to address any questions, or PM me with your location so we can connect you with your territory manager.

Jay McCay - National Sales Manager

908-328-7154

jmccay@energykinetics.com

https://energykinetics.com/afue/

JNE80

My preferred ans trusted installer is familiar with the Buderous and Trio amoung others. He wants to install the Pure Pro Trio cast iron boiler with Beckett NX burner and a Monarch 40 Gallon indirect water heater with lifetime warranty .