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System design

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Kpxxx
Kpxxx Member Posts: 4

Hello

I need a little help to fix this inherited mess ….

This is one zone System

Aqua balance 80c

Hot water baseboard system

The red zone does not get much heat

Should I eliminate the T's , put a circulation pump on that loop . Any other suggestions ?
Thanks for the help !!

Comments

  • DCContrarian
    DCContrarian Member Posts: 215
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    When I see a third floor radiator that doesn't get much heat, the first thing I look at is whether the water in the boiler has enough pressure to reach the third floor. The second thing I look at is making sure absolutely all of the air is out of that loop. I would check those two things before doing anything else.

    Since it's old/new-to-you, we don't know if it once worked and has stopped, or whether it never worked. Eyeballing it, I'd guess the third floor was added on after the rest of it.

    Are the valves marked with X's zone valves? Balancing valves?

    Kpxxx
  • Kpxxx
    Kpxxx Member Posts: 4
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    balancing valves

    It's only one zone

    The hot water gets "lost in the middle of the second floor before it gets to the 3rd floor tee

  • EBEBRATT-Ed
    EBEBRATT-Ed Member Posts: 15,764
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    If you already have balancing valves I would get a thermometer (something electronic is best) that you can strap on the return from each zone.

    You have a couple of zones (in fact all the other zones) that could be stealing the water flow you need. Water takes the path of least resistance.

    Put the thermometer on the return from zone nearest the boiler. Your goal is to get all zones reading the same return temp. You going to have to go back and forth a lot to dial it in.

    You could probably buy a cheap infrared thermometer and shoot the pipes with that to get the temps. If you have copper tubing put electrical tape over the spot you shoot at.

    If you can't get it to balance it could be the circulator, but I seriously doubt it.

    Also, what @DCContrarian mentioned make sure your boiler has enough pressure. 15 psi is normal for two stories you may need a little more with 3 stories depending on building height.

    Measure the height from the boiler to the third floor radiation. You can take a string with a weight on it and toss it out the third-floor window to help measure.

    Once you have the height in feet divide that # by 2.31 and add 4 to that which will equal the psi you need.

    Mad Dog_2
  • Kpxxx
    Kpxxx Member Posts: 4
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    The pressure seems fine . I put it in around 24—5 just to see if that you eliminate the problem I did not

    Do you guys think if I eliminate the last Tee going from the second to the attic and have one 2-3 floor loop will better the system flow ?

  • EBEBRATT-Ed
    EBEBRATT-Ed Member Posts: 15,764
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    If you mean putting the third floor and second floor radiation in series that could possible fix it. If you already have balancing valves in the system I would rather balance it. That way the whole system would work better. Did you check to see if the third-floor radiation is air bound?

  • LRCCBJ
    LRCCBJ Member Posts: 169
    edited June 9
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    If the "water gets lost in the middle of the second floor", you certainly cannot balance it. Close the valves on both the first floor and the third floor and purge the second floor thoroughly. Hopefully, you have valves near the boiler to accomplish. Be sure you get proper flow and heat to the second floor when you are done.

    Then, close the second floor and open the third floor. Repeat the purging procedure. Confirm that that you have proper flow and heat to the third floor when you are done.

    Then, open the third floor and the first floor and the problem should now be resolved and you can proceed to balance the system. The second floor valve will absolutely need to be closed approx 1/2 way to get the water to flow to the third floor. Water takes the path of least resistance and would rather not go to the third floor.

    Purge at 25-28 psi. Not less. Not more. This may require an assistant depending on the type of fill valve you have.

  • hot_rod
    hot_rod Member Posts: 22,382
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    if the circulator is on the return of the boiler, and you are pumping at the expansion tank, that will make air elimination a bigger problem. Any auto air vents at the top of the system?

    A pressure gauge at the upper most point should read at least 5 psi, with the circulator running.

    Count up how many feet of radiation on each loop to get an idea of how many gpm you need to balance to each loop.

    Bob "hot rod" Rohr
    trainer for Caleffi NA
    Living the hydronic dream
  • Kpxxx
    Kpxxx Member Posts: 4
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    I have auto air valves at the end of each loop

    I did not measure with the Gage ( maybe tomorrow ) but when I olen the auto air valve on the third floor there is enough pressure