GV90+ or IBC HC series (Help me choose)

Tommymc1951

Currently, I have a 22 yr old Buderus L115 oil fired boiler which needs work and my oil tank has also been red-tagged for leakage. One option is to replace the tank and fix the boiler, but I've been getting advice that this might be a good time to transition to propane.
One contractor is keen to install a Weil-Mclean GV90+, which I gather is an old school boiler that's increased its efficiency to over 91% by adding a condensing unit. He doesn't like wall hung units because "they only last 10 years and need more repairs."

I had a second contractor come by, and he is hot on wall-hung IBC HC series boilers, over 95% efficiency. He says they are reliable and he carries all the parts likely to fail. He also raves over the customer service rep.

I've also talked with a couple different service techs from our fuel supplier (Irving) and they say that in general, wall hung units are trouble prone. So I'm having a hard time deciding which way to go.

I guess the least expensive is to just repair our Buderus and get a new tank. One contractor advised to get a lined tank because they hold up better to bio-fuel which is on the near horizon in Vermont. He figures "on average" I could expect another 10 yrs out of the Buderus.

Vermont just had extensive flooding and most contractors are crazy busy replacing systems that were destroyed in flooded basements. My choice may be dictated by who is available, but I would appreciate any advice or opinions on the options I've been presented with.

hot_rod

My experience with owning and installing many mod cons dating back to the late 80 Munchkins is... Properly installed and tuned in, serviced every few years, good water quality 15- 20 years is more realistic.

After 15 years or so it is more about parts availability with so many different brands and repair parts required. Unless a wholesaler hordes parts, they seem to sunset or obsolete repair components.
Try finding a mix valve for an mid 90's GV boiler

This seems to be true with all appliances these days.

I can't even get recall repair parts for my 2022 Ram pickup, been waiting over 1 year for simple recall parts! I keep getting critical recall notices on the screen in the truck, however.

IBC would be my choice.

Tom_133

Being a fellow Vermonter and understanding the lack of knowledgable service techs in our area I would lean GV. I hear Hotrod loud and clear, but the mentality in VT is install and dont touch til it breaks. That happens within a few years on most wall hungs, and in the last 10 years I have worked on less than 10% of the GV's I have installed. They are pretty robust, and much more forgiving to incompetent installs. They come at a higher price and you need a way to make hot water because most wall hungs can do both. Not sure what part of VT but the IBC boilers are only supported by one wholesaler in Central VT and that can make getting parts tough.

kcopp

Is this Natural or LP gas. Cost for btu could be a big difference.
I have an IBC in my own home. I also have installed about 150 of them. Great boiler.
That being said I would be inclined to keep the 115.
Who flagged the tank? Is it truly leaking?

Tommymc1951

kcopp said:

Is this Natural or LP gas. Cost for btu could be a big difference.
I have an IBC in my own home. I also have installed about 150 of them. Great boiler.
That being said I would be inclined to keep the 115.
Who flagged the tank? Is it truly leaking?

Long story about the oil tank. Irving red flagged it in their annual inspection because of the way the fuel gauge was installed. It had a reducing coupling which raised it several inches higher than they would like, and that would affect the fill whistle. They were unfazed by the fact that it had been that way for 40 yrs, and they had passed it several times already. So I replaced the reducer with a flange and called them back for a follow up inspection and routine boiler cleaning. While working on the tank, I noticed the bottom had wet spots.....no actual puddles, but the bottom of the tank is oily to the touch. I have no doubt that the tank is ready to be replaced. When they serviced the Buderus, it was partially blocked with soot. (Yes, it had been cleaned regularly) Apparently the something had gone wrong with the cone or blast tube(?), causing the flame to produce excess soot. The resulting blockage caused excess heat. One of the baffle inserts crumbles, and the other is warped bad enough that it can't slide out. The door insulation also probably needs replacing. I haven't gotten an estimate, but piecing together everything, I think I'm probably looking at somewhere in spitting distance of $3k for the tank and burner repairs.

Oh, and one contractor did mention that VT is pushing for bio-fuels I would want a more expensive lined tank, just in case.

The IBC would be propane. We already have it for cooking, hot water, and dryer. Call me old school, but I don't like the idea of a combo unit. All eggs in one basket? Also, I suspect DHW is more destructive than recirculating the same water for baseboards.

JUGHNE

If you have baseboard convectors, they may have to run at a high water temp that would drop the efficiency of the Mod Con combi for part of the heating season so the WM GV90 might be a wash with the combi.

If your LP WH dies you can get an indirect WH tank that has a heat exchanger inside to use the boiler water for heating the domestic HW.

I would go with what Tom_133 said above for the reasons stated.

Hot_water_fan

Call me old school, but I don't like the idea of a combo unit. All eggs in one basket? 

It’s definitely personal preference. Probably 95+% of Americans have separate systems. There aren’t huge advantages to either choice, flip a coin if you’re feeling indecisive . 

hot_rod

Manufacturers tell me over 40 of sales  are tankless or combis now So consumers must be learning how to live within their limitations 

Tom_133

hot_rod said:

Manufacturers tell me over 40 of sales  are tankless or combis now So consumers must be learning how to live within their limitations 

Hotrod, this could also be the case of how I buy my appliances, buy the cheapest with the longest warranty and hope for the best! They are all junk!

Mad Dog_2

My two cents from a NYC Flatlander..Put a few bucks in to the G115...Very solid, chunky, German boiler...built like a Panzer Tank.  Put dozens in.. Great performer.  Do you have The Logamatic Control on top of the boiler?? (BLUE BOX)And, id  go for a new tank.  You have some VG options with new tanks.... Granby, Highland, Roth.  Take your pick.all high qaulity.  I'm up through Bennington on a regular basis visiting a close friend from Long Island 🏝.  Also visit my other musician pal from HS up in Burlington . What town are you in? Mad Dog 🐕 

Tommymc1951

Mad Dog_2 said:

I'm up through Bennington on a regular basis visiting a close friend from Long Island 🏝.  Also visit my other musician pal from HS up in Burlington . What town are you in? Mad Dog 🐕 

Middlesex, just north of Montpelier. I play guitar and pedal steel in a couple of bands. Through the years, I've played with a few from the Burlington area. I may have run into your pal, but there are a lot of musicians up there.

No my G115 doesn't have the Logamatic Control. Repairing it is definitely the least expensive (and simplest) way to go. I am a little concerned about whether there has been any damage to the cast iron. There was enough heat to turn one of the baffles into the consistency of styrofoam, and the other one warped. I'm guessing the water probably kept the cast iron body from overheating. It isn't leaking. If I get another 10 yrs out of it for half the price of converting to a propane mod-con, I can see some logic. Some people are saying I may only get 10 yrs out of a mod con. The G115 has been getting 87.9% efficiency. The breakeven point for fuel savings with a mod con might be getting close to that 10 yr point.

I think what also concerns me is what oil is going to cost in the future. Anybody have a crystal ball?

Tommymc1951

Tom_133 said:

Hotrod, this could also be the case of how I buy my appliances, buy the cheapest with the longest warranty and hope for the best! They are all junk!

I'm with you there. We just replaced kitchen appliances that were 35 yrs old. True, I had done a few simple repairs along the way, but they were still operational. They say life expectancy of the replacements is around 10-12 yrs. My mother's house was built in 1953 and the original natural gas boiler was still operational when we sold it in 2020.

Tom_133

I live in Berlin and work a lot over in Middlesex if you need a hand.

Tommymc1951

Tom_133 said:

I live in Berlin and work a lot over in Middlesex if you need a hand.

I would be grateful for any help you might be able to provide. I'll message you with my contact information.