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indirect with small footprint but high output?

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I have a customer with an indirect 2nd in 7 years same manufacturer that is leaking. size is 20 in diameter and 58 high and with boiler of 180kbtu output at 90 degree rise to attain 140 starting from 50 degrees, it says it outputs 280 gallons first hour and 241 continuous.. only Tank that i see competes is a turbomax and its 2 inches wider. checked weil mclein, burnham, crown, all either physically much bigger or less performance for same size. He has no room in his boiler room for much bigger than 20 x58. anyone know of a small tank with big kick? Turbomax is twice the price of what he has now.
thanks
Joe

Comments

  • mattmia2
    mattmia2 Member Posts: 9,959
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    Obviously the boiler is going to be the limiting factor, but look at the htp commercial/solar tanks with 2 coils.
    GGross
  • Mad Dog_2
    Mad Dog_2 Member Posts: 7,245
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    Turbomax or Buderus 120   mad dog 🐕 
    HVACNUT
  • HVACNUT
    HVACNUT Member Posts: 5,888
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    TurboMax 23. Don't forget the mixing valve and T&P. 
    Pipe if full 1.25" with the correct circulator on priority. Price is relative to need. 
  • Karl Reynolds
    Karl Reynolds Member Posts: 63
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    Triangle Tube Smart 50. 180* boiler water, 90* rise, 200gph continuous, 240 first hour (based on 150 MBH boiler output). 22" diameter, 57" tall.
  • hot_rod
    hot_rod Member Posts: 22,476
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    If you have a 180K actual  boiler output and you gave 50 degree incoming wanting 140F?

    You could do the math snd  size a flat plat heat exchanger. Then add whatever size  tank you can find to fit. An external hx indirect👍🏻

    sized generously you have a 180 tankless😉

    What is the failure? Leaking tanks?
    Check if the water quality matches the tank construction

    High chloride levels can take out stainless tanks quickly, usually void the warranty also
    Bob "hot rod" Rohr
    trainer for Caleffi NA
    Living the hydronic dream
  • GroundUp
    GroundUp Member Posts: 1,956
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    Does he really need that much output though? Just because that's what's in there doesn't mean it's the right size. Seems pretty crazy for anything short of a 4 bay car wash. The S20W series from NTI is a wall hung indirect which is only the size of a carry-on suitcase and puts out 212 GPH continuous or 229 first hour with a 180k output at 140 degrees. Plus they come with a mixing valve.
    GGross
  • Joseph_4
    Joseph_4 Member Posts: 278
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    thx guys.. i put in the turbomax 23 which is now called 30-3. its price is reasonable and is half the turbomax 45 cost.. the amount is over 300gph 18 and a bit diameter and 51 high wo prv. looks like this will be my go to from now on
    thanks
    joe
    STEAM DOCTOR
  • STEAM DOCTOR
    STEAM DOCTOR Member Posts: 2,041
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    @Joseph_4 Amazing. On this topic. I have never installed or dealt with a turbomax. Just interested on the community's thoughts. In regards to performance, efficiency, longevity..... I just did a tiny bit of research and seems that some claim that they do not perform well with low output boilers. I am speaking from total ignorance. All thoughts are welcome. Thanks.
  • mattmia2
    mattmia2 Member Posts: 9,959
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    They have some reserve but kind of become a shell and tube hx with a sustained load.
  • hot_rod
    hot_rod Member Posts: 22,476
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    @Joseph_4 Amazing. On this topic. I have never installed or dealt with a turbomax. Just interested on the community's thoughts. In regards to performance, efficiency, longevity..... I just did a tiny bit of research and seems that some claim that they do not perform well with low output boilers. I am speaking from total ignorance. All thoughts are welcome. Thanks.

    I had one instance where the orifice plate at the cold water input scaled almost shut. So water volume dropped to almost nothing. It would barely flow a lav sink!
    Keep the boiler SWT as low as possible to get the job done. Their charts show output at various SWT, or trial and error. Lower boiler temperature also gets you higher efficiencies.

    Scale precipitation is an issue in any tank, higher temperature= more mineral precip.
    Bob "hot rod" Rohr
    trainer for Caleffi NA
    Living the hydronic dream
  • Alan (California Radiant) Forbes
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    I just found out that NTI has a 20 gallon, wall-hung indirect. One or two might work for you?

    https://ntiboilers.com/product/s20w
    8.33 lbs./gal. x 60 min./hr. x 20°ΔT = 10,000 BTU's/hour

    Two btu per sq ft for degree difference for a slab
  • EdTheHeaterMan
    EdTheHeaterMan Member Posts: 8,167
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    indirect with small footprint but high output?

    I think I found the culprit. Still waiting for footprint cast molds to come back from the forensics lab.

    Edward Young Retired

    After you make that expensive repair and you still have the same problem, What will you check next?

    GGrossAlan (California Radiant) Forbes