Removing a ProPress Fitting

Alan (California Radiant) Forbes

Has anyone had any luck removing one of these and replacing it with another ProPress or solder fitting?  Seems not possible. 

I have a job that is fitting-to-fitting and want to add a DirtMag. 

PC7060

Cutting out has been my only option in those situations. I’d be interested to hear if anyone has a good method.  

Mad Dog_2

Wirsbo/Uponor Propex?   The Pex ring? I carefully cut in to the ring with a Pex knife 🔪..then u can wiggle off the tubing.  Mad Dog  🐕 

hot_rod

I think it distorts the tube when you press the fitting? My REMS tool leaves a hexagon shape after the press.

Mad Dog_2

Oh...I'm thinking Propex...Nope...usually have to cut it back to clean pipe.  Thats one bad thing about it.  Mad Dog 🐕 

dko

Without destroying one of the fittings, no. Basically surgery with a dremel and mini cutoff blade so you don't nick the copper pipe. Like cutting a line through a broken nipple on a threaded fitting, except extra ptfe and dope won't save you if you go too far. Then you can press another fitting on the open pipe, but press in the same orientation as the deformed pipe.

STEVEusaPA

I agree with @hot_rod. It deforms the tubing. If you were able, I’d think melting the ring and sliding it off would work. But psychologically, getting a torch to remove/fix a press fitting seems odd to me.

kcopp

Yes.
It can be done. Need to be gentle... goes w/o saying. Oscillating tool cut parallel w the pipe. Careful to not gouge the tubing. Make about 3 cuts. Then carefully pry open the tabs then give it a twist off. The key is to press the piping back on so it gives a similar press pattern.

EBEBRATT-Ed

I agree with @hot rod the tubing is pressed octagonal so your not getting a sweat fitting on it unless maybe you anneal the tubing and make the tubing round pound a fitting on it and braze it....ug what a mess.

Don't know if pressing a fitting on it in the same orientation is goo practice or not

kcopp

EBEBRATT-Ed said:

I agree with @hot rod the tubing is pressed octagonal so your not getting a sweat fitting on it unless maybe you anneal the tubing and make the tubing round pound a fitting on it and braze it....ug what a mess.

Don't know if pressing a fitting on it in the same orientation is goo practice or not

Its not ideal but sometimes you get stuck...

mattmia2

I think you can cut off the fitting by cutting only the fitting then sweat on a new fitting. might need a tube expander to bring the pipe back up to the original size. Once you cut a slot or 2 almost through the fitting it will split easily since it is copper. Crimping another propress on after the tube has been shrunk seems dicey at best.

Mad Dog_2

Right, we don't always have the best options, but Silver-Brazing will be your best option if you have  misshapen, crinkled tubing.  Mad Dog 🐕 

GroundUp

I've done it a few times, but it's not easy nor is it a great joint. It's very easy to nick the ring on the new fitting due to the hex shape. This right here is my #1 gripe with press.

MaxMercy

Alan (California Radiant) Forbes said:

Has anyone had any luck removing one of these and replacing it with another ProPress or solder fitting?  Seems not possible. 

I have a job that is fitting-to-fitting and want to add a DirtMag. 

You have to cut it back and use a ProPress coupling if you intend to keep it Press because I don't think you'd ever get that pipe round again, at least without a lot of effort. Otherwise, even if you could Dremel the fitting off without nicking the pipe, you'd have to reshape the previously crimped pipe to allow a new fitting and sweat that on or braze it.

If it were my job, I'd just cut out the Pressed fitting in question and use some new pipe and sweat slip couplings.

EdTheHeaterMan

I think someone will invent a reverse press tool with little hands that grab the copper molecules and pull them back into the original shape. Use the same technology as the cast iron radiators that "hold the heat" (see related post here) https://forum.heatinghelp.com/discussion/comment/1709810#Comment_1709810

dko

They make rerounders for type L/K
https://starlightplugs.com/rt-2-l-3-4-copper-rounding-tool-type-l/
https://www.reedmfgco.com/en/products/water-services-tools/round-it-straightener-rerounder/

I mean you'd probably just replace the section before you order more tools but if it happened to have very expensive components on either side.. possibly.

hot_rod

It would tough, not impossible, to put a new fitting over a removed one. At least with the tool I have. It distorts it on both inner and outer wall.

mattmia2

I knew there was this type of tool for exhaust tubing and I know there are all sorts of tools for making fittingless connections for refrigeration work in copper so I figured there was a tool to reshape copper pipe to its original size too.

https://www.napaonline.com/en/p/SER2071?impressionRank=1

Larry Weingarten

Hmm, @mattmia2 , that tool reminds me of PEX expansion tools 😉

Yours, Larry

mattmia2

Larry Weingarten said:

Hmm, @mattmia2 , that tool reminds me of PEX expansion tools 😉

Yours, Larry

Actually, the version I posted is the version I am familiar with, but google also found a version that fits a miwaukee/wirsbo type expansion tool.

EDIT: Or maybe not, looks like it was just a pex expansion tool that it somehow got from "exhaust expansion tool"

mattmia2

Also, this is why using the npt version of expensive components is a great idea, all you are out is an adapter if you need to rework something, no chance of burning up an expensive part trying to remove and sweat in a new piece of copper.

hot_rod

A REMS Ex-press will swage the tube for a fitting end. You need to soften the copper first or it will split. This tool will do up to 1-3/8 (1-1/4") copper tube. Also pex expansion heads are available.

Alan (California Radiant) Forbes

A few of you suggested pressing in the same orientation as the previous fitting, but wouldn’t an opposing orientation re-shape the copper for a better chance of sealing against the o-ring?

I like that REMS Ex-press tool, but I don’t know if you could fit it into the pipe that has been deformed by ProPress. 

kcopp

Alan (California Radiant) Forbes said:

A few of you suggested pressing in the same orientation as the previous fitting, but wouldn’t an opposing orientation re-shape the copper for a better chance of sealing against the o-ring?

I like that REMS Ex-press tool, but I don’t know if you could fit it into the pipe that has been deformed by ProPress. 

I understand your logic.
When getting Viega training they did say that if you needed to "adjust" the press fitting, keep the jaws on the fitting and keep the same "footprint". If you press against the original shape you would risk breaking the seal and possibly have a leak....

mattmia2

Alan (California Radiant) Forbes said:

>I like that REMS Ex-press tool, but I don’t know if you could fit it into the pipe that has been deformed by ProPress. 

I suspect you'd need to start with a size or 2 smaller to re-round it before you could stretch it to the needed size.

hot_rod

The pics I showed above are the demo. Press, cut off, soften, insert REMS swage tool. The expander fits into the tube easily, no muscle needed😳

Fairly easy modification really. Just take care cutting the old fitting off to not cut into the tube

Larry Weingarten

Hi, Isn't the difficulty with reshaping work hardened copper, that you can't really soften it with heat because in this case other press fittings are so close by, that you would cook/burn their seals?

Yours, Larry

Alan (California Radiant) Forbes

Larry Weingarten said:

Hi, Isn't the difficulty with reshaping work hardened copper, that you can't really soften it with heat because in this case other press fittings are so close by, that you would cook/burn their seals?

Yours, Larry

Exactly. I've put wet rags around adjacent fittings before when soft soldering, but annealing takes a higher temperature and I'd be worried.

Intplm.

Hey there @Alan(CaliforniaRadiant)Forbes
Maybe the only thing I don't like about Propress is there are no second chances. You just cant remove a press once it's done.
I've had some bad presses as large as 4". Just have to cut them out and start over. Doing so in a tight space is such a shame too.
I, (ahem!) have also soldered missed press fittings too. That can work sometimes but if you are too close to a good -o- ring? Well then that's another story

mattmia2

Alan (California Radiant) Forbes said:

Larry Weingarten said:

Hi, Isn't the difficulty with reshaping work hardened copper, that you can't really soften it with heat because in this case other press fittings are so close by, that you would cook/burn their seals?

Yours, Larry

Exactly. I've put wet rags around adjacent fittings before when soft soldering, but annealing takes a higher temperature and I'd be worried.

If the rag is still wet it isn't getting above 212 f at that point.

Big Ed_4

I would start fresh ... Retrofitting is always messy