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1890 Oswego NY Victorian House Museum, Overall system for comment

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NealJ
NealJ Member Posts: 43
Photos of overall boiler configuration & boiler controls. Seems to be working OK, not sure about the pressure switch settings. Assuming the one on the left is an High High cutoff, the one on the right is High pressure cutoff. I’ve since straightened out the out-of-plumb switches that the local tech left that way after our fall inspection. I also bought a new pigs tail to be sure the threads tighten up acceptably. Everything look OK?







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  • mattmia2
    mattmia2 Member Posts: 9,653
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    The pressure is set way to high and that copper header doesn't allow for thermal expansion of the boiler sections and the connections to it are in the wrong order.
  • KC_Jones
    KC_Jones Member Posts: 5,737
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    Ok the pressure safeties are set way, way too high. Whatever one is primary should be set as low as possible, and whichever is backup set just a bit higher, mainly so one doesn't interfere with the other.

    The header piping is incorrect
    1. Copper shouldn't be on steam piping, you can see evidence of joint failure already.
    2. The order of the header is wrong. Should be riser, riser, system take off(s), drop to equalizer.
    3. The header piping may be undersized, need to know what size EG it is to know for sure. Appears to be maybe a 55, but need to see the data sticker to know for sure. I also can't tell in pictures what size it might be so this is more of just a check than an actual problem.

    The other thing I would suggest is to do a radiator survey and calculate the system EDR. If you need help with this we can assist. This will give you an idea if the boiler is properly sized, will also give you information to be able to plan for future replacement with a properly sized boiler. Sizing is done incorrectly all the time on steam, but it's really not too difficult, but it is important.

    2014 Weil Mclain EG-40
    EcoSteam ES-20 Advanced Boiler Control
    Boiler pictures updated 2/21/15
    CLamb
  • NealJ
    NealJ Member Posts: 43
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    Boiler nameplate:


  • KC_Jones
    KC_Jones Member Posts: 5,737
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    https://www.weil-mclain.com/sites/default/files/field-file/EG PEG Series 6 Boiler Manual - Web Version.pdf

    Scroll down to page 17. That size, to be minimum spec should be 2-2" risers into a 3" header, or a single 3" riser into the same 3" header. That is the minimum spec. I can't tell what you have there, the arrangement is incorrect no matter what.

    Again a radiator survey would determine if that is even the right sized boiler. If it's oversized, I wouldn't do anything with it, save the money and wait till it fails and needs replaced, during that time come up with the proper size, and work on finding a contractor that would either pipe it right, or willing to listen to plans on how to pipe it right. Either way they need to be able to work with up to 3" threaded steel pipe.
    2014 Weil Mclain EG-40
    EcoSteam ES-20 Advanced Boiler Control
    Boiler pictures updated 2/21/15
  • CLamb
    CLamb Member Posts: 281
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    You also need to find someone more competent than that "local tech". I realize it may be hard to find someone locally and that the Museum owners may not have much money to spend.
  • NealJ
    NealJ Member Posts: 43
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    I’ll have to take some measurements… But the piping off of the boiler is at least 2-1/2”…
    Thanks!
  • JUGHNE
    JUGHNE Member Posts: 11,061
    edited December 2022
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    Considering the pressure controls; the left one with clear cover looks to be high pressure cutout, often with manual reset required. (button or lever poking thru the case somewhere).

    It has a hanging pendulum inside on the right side, there is usually a white mark inside the case that indicates if the unit is plumb. This is important for any mercury switch accuracy. Adjust this switch 3-4 PSI above operating pressure. It should never have to operate/open.

    The grey control on the right is not sensitive to being level as it contains a microswitch inside.
    This is your operating control for the boiler.
    This is set as low as possible on the outside scale without the linkage inside coming apart and as low as possible on the inside dial under the cover.

    Your pressure gauge may not show 1-2 PSI. That 0-30 is code required so you should consider a 0-5 PSI added to the pigtail.

    You mentioned your tstat shutting off the boiler before heating was complete.
    You need long cycles for the heating system and only 1-2 cycles per hour.
    What tstat do you have?

    Usually, for the not perfect piping of a system such as this, the pressure control cycles the boiler during a run cycle.

    You want no more than 2 PSI for the system.
    Just adjust the control down to the bottom.....not to worry.

    My personal theory (perhaps twisted somewhat) on low pressure steam moving faster than high pressure steam is that low pressure is big and fat like the Michelin tire man, he has to get out of the way because there are a lot more fat men behind him as the boiler is pushing them out thru the pipes. And high pressure works the opposite way, not having to move that fast.

    I have seen some systems running at your pressure, that by getting the pressure down to near 2 PSI would stop small leaks on valves, flanges and even radiators, and make the vents work better.

    Note: in addition to the books you might buy here you could get a "Pocket Rocket" pipe size measuring tool.



    NealJbburdCLamb
  • EdTheHeaterMan
    EdTheHeaterMan Member Posts: 7,838
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    This might be an acceptable repipe design.


    Edward F Young. Retired HVAC ContractorSpecialized in Residential Oil Burner and Hydronics
    NealJLong Beach Ed
  • neilc
    neilc Member Posts: 2,703
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    This might be an acceptable repipe design.


    you sir are a magician,
    how in the h3!! do you do this
    known to beat dead horses
  • mattmia2
    mattmia2 Member Posts: 9,653
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    This might be an acceptable repipe design.


    Does the asbestos move without being disturbed?

    You could make the header in to a horizontal u to get the piping right if you cant shift the boiler right.
  • Mad Dog_2
    Mad Dog_2 Member Posts: 6,933
    edited December 2022
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    Interesting project.  Has it been repiped yet?  Mad Dog
  • NealJ
    NealJ Member Posts: 43
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    This might be an acceptable repipe design.


    Yes, Love it! I was thinking that if I’m going to do this, I should move the boiler to the right and redo all of the near boiler piping.