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What's the difference between these two pipes at Home Depot?

newtonkid88
newtonkid88 Member Posts: 100
#1) https://www.homedepot.com/p/Southland-1-in-x-10-ft-Black-Steel-Pipe-585-1200HC/100535170

#2) https://www.homedepot.com/p/STZ-1-in-x-5-ft-Black-Steel-Schedule-40-Cut-Pipe-306-1X60/100554212

These two are available in-store. They are essentially the same price but #1 is double the length. Both are ASTM A53 but #1 is listed as Grade A. I will have Home Depot cut threads.

This is for a hot water baseboard heat system, plumbing near the boiler. The

Comments

  • EdTheHeaterMan
    EdTheHeaterMan Member Posts: 4,288
    edited August 14
    About Exactly 5 Ft.
    Edward Young
    Retired HVAC Contractor from So. Jersey.
    Services first oil burner at age 16
    P/T trainer for EH-CC.org

    HomerJSmithJohnNY
  • newtonkid88
    newtonkid88 Member Posts: 100
    Why does HD offer both pipes at the same price?.... if the specs appear to be the same. I might as well buy the more expensive one per foot incase it is a higher quality.

    About Exactly 5 Ft.

  • EdTheHeaterMan
    EdTheHeaterMan Member Posts: 4,288
    edited August 14
    At the Home Depot in Charleston SC the price for the 10ft is $39.61 and the price for the 5ft. $27.91 But that is a local thing. Every HD has the price based on the cost of the material and the transportation and volume sold. So to update my answer for Charleston SC the difference is $11.70. ...or about $1.62 per foot. ...or about $6.35 per threaded end.

    But since we are not supposed to discuss pricing here I will cross out the actual prices. Please don't read the crossed our parts of this post. Just look them up yourself at your own Home Depot.

    If one was a savvy businessman, he might purchase one 10 footer and use the "FREE" threading service. I believe the coupling is less than the price difference in the event you want to put the two pieces back together. You got to use your head in the big stuff!

    And it is still exactly 5 ft difference in length.
    Edward Young
    Retired HVAC Contractor from So. Jersey.
    Services first oil burner at age 16
    P/T trainer for EH-CC.org

    newtonkid88PC7060MaxMercy
  • newtonkid88
    newtonkid88 Member Posts: 100
    edited August 14
    I understand the economics of my situation. But my concern is the quality or specifications of the pipes.
    The 10 footer is almost shiny, glossy black. The 5 footer is a dull gray. HD's website say they are similar but I'm just wondering if I'm missing something because I dont know what I dont know.
    Usually, you get what you pay for. But the cheaper pipe per foot LOOKS nicer. But I dont know.

    The yellow label is the more expensive per foot from vietnam. The dark black indonesian pipe is the 10 footer. Both pipes are Sch 40 and ASTM A53

  • mattmia2
    mattmia2 Member Posts: 6,688
    The shiny black pipe has been painted for some reason. The different prices are likely different proces from whoever they bought them from. Nonstandard sizes usually seem to cost a lot more per foot.
    newtonkid88
  • EdTheHeaterMan
    EdTheHeaterMan Member Posts: 4,288
    edited August 14
    The make up of the pipe is probably identical. The rating "Schedule 40" of the pipe tells you everything you need. It is steel pipe that will withstand the pressure and temperatures that the rating allows. This is going to rust if used on an open system (fresh water to your tap) or outdoors. Since you are using it on a closed system, inside the building, you can use it and select the lowest cost item. The rating of schedule 40 far exceeds what you are using it for.

    Sorry for the sarcasm above. I was stating the obvious to trades people. I must realize that not everyone that comes here for help understands my warped sense of humor.
    Edward Young
    Retired HVAC Contractor from So. Jersey.
    Services first oil burner at age 16
    P/T trainer for EH-CC.org

    MikeAmann
  • EBEBRATT-Ed
    EBEBRATT-Ed Member Posts: 12,664
    HD probably buys pipe from different sources.

    At a normal supply house 21 footers usually come with a varnish like coating which I am told is USA pipe

    The 10' sticks they sell have like flat black paint on them which I am told means Canada.

    Different countries use different coatings.

    The pipe should be the same it's all ASTM 53........hope....hope
  • newtonkid88
    newtonkid88 Member Posts: 100
    Thanks guys. Ed, I understood your jokes lol.

    I need a 16" nipple. My local HD can only thread 24" or longer. Do local supply houses usually cut and thread? If not, I'll have to use a coupling with shorter pieces.

    The make up of the pipe is probably identical. The rating "Schedule 40" of the pipe tells you everything you need. It is steel pipe that will withstand the pressure and temperatures that the rating allows. This is going to rust if used on an open system (fresh water to your tap) or outdoors. Since you are using it on a closed system, inside the building, you can use it and select the lowest cost item. The rating of schedule 40 far exceeds what you are using it for.

    Sorry for the sarcasm above. I was stating the obvious to trades people. I must realize that not everyone that comes here for help understands my warped sense of humor.

    HD probably buys pipe from different sources.

    At a normal supply house 21 footers usually come with a varnish like coating which I am told is USA pipe

    The 10' sticks they sell have like flat black paint on them which I am told means Canada.

    Different countries use different coatings.

    The pipe should be the same it's all ASTM 53........hope....hope

  • mattmia2
    mattmia2 Member Posts: 6,688
    Of course I dont know if anyone is independently verifying that they meet the spec painted on them.
  • EdTheHeaterMan
    EdTheHeaterMan Member Posts: 4,288
    edited August 14
    Your Local HD does not know how to operate the threader. If you bring the cut pipe to them perhaps they will be able to thread it if you tell the guy "I think it is 24". You can always purchase the proper thread die and then sell it on eBay when finished with it.
    https://www.ebay.com/itm/282709708407?epid=1126578313&hash=item41d2cfce77:g:YCAAAOSwIDJbySyT
    If you don't own a vice you may need to get one of them too.

    Another Idea is to have the piece of pipe ready and go the HD tool rental. See if they can show you how to work the motorized threader on your already cut piece. Then tell them you have to check with your wife and you will be back later.
    Edward Young
    Retired HVAC Contractor from So. Jersey.
    Services first oil burner at age 16
    P/T trainer for EH-CC.org

    MikeAmann
  • EBEBRATT-Ed
    EBEBRATT-Ed Member Posts: 12,664
    @newtonkid88

    Some supply houses do cut and thread, most do not. You can call around.You can buy a 12" nipple at a good supply house and a coupling and a 5" or whatever size you need to make 16"

    Nipples over 6" are sold in 1" increments and close to 6" are sold in 1/2" increments
  • mattmia2
    mattmia2 Member Posts: 6,688
    Most good hardware stores have a threading machine although building something complex all in iron is going to be difficult without being able to thread on site. Using iron to put the threaded components together and copper for the in between sections that have to be a specific length can make thigs a lot easier.
  • STEVEusaPA
    STEVEusaPA Member Posts: 5,881
    I’ve never seen a hardware store with a pipe threading machine.
    steve
    Canucker
  • ChrisJ
    ChrisJ Member Posts: 13,562
    edited August 15
    I've had multiple places screw up ( pun intended) threading pipe for me to the point I bought my own Ridgid 65R-TC.   

    This includes a local plumbing supply three times.  I had another plumbing supply by my job give me straight threads once as well.


    I have a Joe Pesci meme made up about threading pipe similar to his rant about cell phones on lethal weapon.  I'd post it but it's not HH friendly.    

    I invested something to the tune of $1200 for the used threader, pipe vice, pipe cutter etc because I had had enough.    Best part is I recently had the plumbing supply thread a length of 1.25" for me as the length wasn't critical and they didn't run the dies on far enough so a fitting won't even start.   I get to fix that one too both ends.    
    Single pipe quasi-vapor system. Typical operating pressure 0.14 - 0.43 oz. EcoSteam ES-20 Advanced Control for Residential Steam boilers. Rectorseal Steamaster water treatment
  • EdTheHeaterMan
    EdTheHeaterMan Member Posts: 4,288

    I’ve never seen a hardware store with a pipe threading machine.

    You have not looked very hard. The 5th generation family owned ones do!
    The True Value or Ace that just opened in the past 2 decades probably don't

    But that is the way of the world today! "who needs threaded pipe anyway?"

    I feel your pain!
    #oldman #oldfashion #thegoodolddays. Did I do the hashbrown (#) thing right?
    Edward Young
    Retired HVAC Contractor from So. Jersey.
    Services first oil burner at age 16
    P/T trainer for EH-CC.org

    PC7060
  • hot_rod
    hot_rod Member Posts: 17,543
    That hard shiny coating is common on fire sprinkler pipe to resist outer corrosion. Could be the manufacturer sells to that market. It’s a lot easier on your hands also.

    I used Wheatland Mega Flow to pipe my solar array. It has a bigger hole in the center 😗 and is lighter for over head work, plus the nicer coating. The larger ID makes a difference in hydraulic calcs when doing sprinkler work.

    You can thread down to a schedule 10 wall pipe

    Bad threads happen to even the pros on a regular basis  Steel isn’t what it used to be it chips and tears so much easier now, even the domestic stuff.
    Bob "hot rod" Rohr
    trainer for Caleffi NA
    Living the hydronic dream
  • MikeAmann
    MikeAmann Member Posts: 645
    I use a wire wheel on all of my threaded connections, even copper and brass.
    It smooths out the roughness of the newly cut threads and tightens (and esp. loosens) without galling.
  • newtonkid88
    newtonkid88 Member Posts: 100
    Your Local HD does not know how to operate the threader. If you bring the cut pipe to them perhaps they will be able to thread it if you tell the guy "I think it is 24". You can always purchase the proper thread die and then sell it on eBay when finished with it. https://www.ebay.com/itm/282709708407?epid=1126578313&hash=item41d2cfce77:g:YCAAAOSwIDJbySyT If you don't own a vice you may need to get one of them too. Another Idea is to have the piece of pipe ready and go the HD tool rental. See if they can show you how to work the motorized threader on your already cut piece. Then tell them you have to check with your wife and you will be back later.
    I got a longer pipe threaded at HD. I believe it really does need to be 24” because it appears that’s how far the two hold-down straps are from each other. Any shorter, the pipe would only be secured by 1 strap. That would cause the pipe to flap around in the housing as it spins.
  • mattmia2
    mattmia2 Member Posts: 6,688
    As long as you get it reasonably square to the die, the die should align itself, but there is a minimum length a particular machine can thread, you have to use pre-made nipples below that.
  • JohnNY
    JohnNY Member Posts: 3,006
    ChrisJ said:

    I had another plumbing supply by my job give me straight threads once as well.

    Straight threads to me means machine threads, i.e. not tapered. Why would a plumbing supply shop even have a die for that kind of thread? The world's gone topsy-turvy I tell ya.
    Contact John "JohnNY" Cataneo, NYC Master Plumber, Lic 1784
    Consulting
    Plumbing in NYC or in NJ.
    Take his class.
  • ChrisJ
    ChrisJ Member Posts: 13,562
    JohnNY said:

    ChrisJ said:

    I had another plumbing supply by my job give me straight threads once as well.

    Straight threads to me means machine threads, i.e. not tapered. Why would a plumbing supply shop even have a die for that kind of thread? The world's gone topsy-turvy I tell ya.

    I believe they used conduit dies in the machine instead of NPT.

    Single pipe quasi-vapor system. Typical operating pressure 0.14 - 0.43 oz. EcoSteam ES-20 Advanced Control for Residential Steam boilers. Rectorseal Steamaster water treatment
  • JohnNY
    JohnNY Member Posts: 3,006
    edited August 17
    ChrisJ said:

    JohnNY said:

    ChrisJ said:

    I had another plumbing supply by my job give me straight threads once as well.

    Straight threads to me means machine threads, i.e. not tapered. Why would a plumbing supply shop even have a die for that kind of thread? The world's gone topsy-turvy I tell ya.
    My point is that they shouldn't even be in the store.



    Contact John "JohnNY" Cataneo, NYC Master Plumber, Lic 1784
    Consulting
    Plumbing in NYC or in NJ.
    Take his class.
    STEVEusaPA
  • ChrisJ
    ChrisJ Member Posts: 13,562
    JohnNY said:
    I had another plumbing supply by my job give me straight threads once as well.
    Straight threads to me means machine threads, i.e. not tapered. Why would a plumbing supply shop even have a die for that kind of thread? The world's gone topsy-turvy I tell ya.
    My point is that they shouldn't even be in the store.
    What do I know I don't run a plumbing supply 😂
    Single pipe quasi-vapor system. Typical operating pressure 0.14 - 0.43 oz. EcoSteam ES-20 Advanced Control for Residential Steam boilers. Rectorseal Steamaster water treatment
  • pedmec
    pedmec Member Posts: 672
    thats not true. don't know what model threader they use at hd but i use a ridgid 300 machine and can make a nipple down to its smallest size (close) with a nipple chuck.have not seen a michine that needs both jaws closed to thread. the rear jaws come into play with longer pieces
  • mattmia2
    mattmia2 Member Posts: 6,688
    JohnNY said:

    ChrisJ said:

    I had another plumbing supply by my job give me straight threads once as well.

    Straight threads to me means machine threads, i.e. not tapered. Why would a plumbing supply shop even have a die for that kind of thread? The world's gone topsy-turvy I tell ya.
    Maybe they were using the wrong side of the die.
  • JUGHNE
    JUGHNE Member Posts: 10,044
    My small town (pop 600) local lumber yard has a Rigid 300 threader up to 2"
    They sell a fair amount of galv pipe to ranchers and farmers.

    They will cut/thread my own pipe in their machine for a small fee ......and if I ask nicely.

    For your 16" needs you might try an 8" and 7 1/2" with a coupling, or some combination of 3 nipples and 2 couplings.
  • STEVEusaPA
    STEVEusaPA Member Posts: 5,881
    They also make nipple chucks for stationary pipe threaders.
    https://static.grainger.com/rp/s/is/image/Grainger/60PY57_AS01?hei=1072&wid=1072
    Just don’t buy them from Graingers.
    steve
  • pedmec
    pedmec Member Posts: 672
    i swear they make everything nowadays. you just got to ask the right person.
    EdTheHeaterMan
  • newtonkid88
    newtonkid88 Member Posts: 100
    edited August 18
    Thanks everybody. HD actually sells a 16” nipple online. Just gotta have it delievred to the store. It’s 1/3 the price of two smaller nipples and a coupling.

    same astm ratings sch40 etc.
  • mattmia2
    mattmia2 Member Posts: 6,688
    I found fittings and nipples were far less expensive from supplyhouse.com
  • DJD775
    DJD775 Member Posts: 185
    edited August 18
    mattmia2 said:

    I found fittings and nipples were far less expensive from supplyhouse.com

    I agree with this 99% percent of the time but I think HD has them beat when it comes to longer lengths of larger diameter pipe.
  • ChrisJ
    ChrisJ Member Posts: 13,562
    DJD775 said:

    mattmia2 said:

    I found fittings and nipples were far less expensive from supplyhouse.com

    I agree with this 99% percent of the time but I think HD has them beat when it comes to longer lengths of larger diameter pipe.
    Could be.
    BUT.
    I find the quality of the threading far superior on nipples from Supplyhouse and McMaster Carr than anything Homer or Lowes has.

    At least it used to be.
    Single pipe quasi-vapor system. Typical operating pressure 0.14 - 0.43 oz. EcoSteam ES-20 Advanced Control for Residential Steam boilers. Rectorseal Steamaster water treatment
  • DJD775
    DJD775 Member Posts: 185
    ChrisJ said:

    DJD775 said:

    mattmia2 said:

    I found fittings and nipples were far less expensive from supplyhouse.com

    I agree with this 99% percent of the time but I think HD has them beat when it comes to longer lengths of larger diameter pipe.
    Could be.
    BUT.
    I find the quality of the threading far superior on nipples from Supplyhouse and McMaster Carr than anything Homer or Lowes has.

    At least it used to be.
    You could be right but I personally haven't had a problem with either source. Supplyhouse also gives you a choice of domestic or import which is not typical of the big box stores.