Peerless Boiler, Controller Temp Lower then Boiler Temp

Paul986

New User

Peerless Boiler WBV-E-04 with Indirect Hot water Heater, 5 Zones with Baseboard Heat. New install in Feb 2022.

Problem;

The Controller seems to be reading a good 12 degrees or so Lower then the Boiler Gauge. Don't know which is correct. The installer says I'm over thinking it and not to worry cause all Peerless Boilers do this.

This came up cause we're having trouble heating the Home when the outside temp gets below 25F or so.

I know it could be other issues but I thought if the controller is calling for 190 and the boiler is only putting out 178 +/- the base boards aren't really heating as they should.

Thanks for any help
Paul

HVACNUT

Is the control a Hydrostat 3250 Plus? If the probe is in correctly, I would trust it over the tridicator gauge. 
What's the economy setting? If High, lower it to 5. If it's on 5, lower it to 4, etc.

EBEBRATT-Ed

It can be several problems or nothing.

Aquastat sensor may not be pushed in the well all the way or it may need heat conductive compound

If the circulators are not running the boiler water may stratify (cooler water at the bottom and hotter water at the top) may cause gauge to differ from aquastat.

Not uncommon for gauge to read 10 degrees or so different from aquastat

But if the house is not heating the contractor needs to come back and figure out why?

Could be airbound

Paul986

HVACNUT said:

Is the control a Hydrostat 3250 Plus? If the probe is in correctly, I would trust it over the tridicator gauge. 
What's the economy setting? If High, lower it to 5. If it's on 5, lower it to 4, etc.

Yes Hydrostst 3250 Plus, going to check out the Economy modes, Soon as I figure out how to change them. Thank you

Paul986

EBEBRATT-Ed said:

It can be several problems or nothing.

Aquastat sensor may not be pushed in the well all the way or it may need heat conductive compound

If the circulators are not running the boiler water may stratify (cooler water at the bottom and hotter water at the top) may cause gauge to differ from aquastat.

Not uncommon for gauge to read 10 degrees or so different from aquastat

But if the house is not heating the contractor needs to come back and figure out why?

Could be airbound

Thank you, The house is heating, all zones are working, just not getting past 68 degrees when real cold out, I'm going to get him back.

EdTheHeaterMan

I used to call the difference between two different thermometers “allowing for Kentucky Windage”

if you purchase a thermometer for scientific testing in a laboratory, don’t expect to pay less than $500.00 for the economy model.  When a boiler manufacturer buys a thermometer for a boiler to meet minimum code specifications, they pay less than $7.00 purchased in bulk.  

If you tell me you believe that both thermometers are just as accurate, I have a bridge for sale in Brooklyn that may interest you 

And what @hv@HVACNUT and @eb@EBEBRATT-Ed said above

Mr Ed

HVACNUT

Paul986 said:

Is the control a Hydrostat 3250 Plus? If the probe is in correctly, I would trust it over the tridicator gauge. 
What's the economy setting? If High, lower it to 5. If it's on 5, lower it to 4, etc.

Yes Hydrostst 3250 Plus, going to check out the Economy modes, Soon as I figure out how to change them. Thank you

Toggle through the red button on top of the Hydrostat. It'll list hi limit, low limit, economy, etc.
There is a dial inside to adjust the setting. 

RSB

Paul, did you ever get a resolution, for the boiler holding 20+ degrees in the boiler.

EdTheHeaterMan

https://forum.heatinghelp.com/discussion/comment/1837686#Comment_1837686

This might be a better question to ask by PM. "Message". I don't always get notified when people post on my discussions until I log on here and see the notification bell at the top. I do however get an email when someone sends me a PM. If Paul986 even looks at this forum any more. According to his profile he has not logged on since March 19, 2022.

That said, I am guessing that you have a similar problem. You should start your own discussion with the particulars of YOUR system. What boiler you have, what control you have and what actual problem you are experiencing.

Is there noise, water leaking, not enough heat, too much heat, or any other thing you are actually experiencing. If your only complaint is that your system is operating perfectly but the dials and gauges don't match up, then that is not really a problem that needs to be fixed.

look at the last date active here > > > > > > > > > > > >

RSB

Thank you Ed I will start a new discussion

"Peerless boiler hydro level temp vs supply temp, and house not keeping up"

HVACNUT

https://forum.heatinghelp.com/discussion/comment/1837707#Comment_1837707

Hydrostat? What are the settings? Does the boiler make limit where the burner shuts off but the circulator(s) still runs?

Is economy mode being used? If so, lower it or turn it off.

In extreme weather it's not uncommon to temporarily raise the High limit temperature from say 180° to 200°. Just remember to turn it back down when the weather warms up.

RSB

High limit 195

Economy is off

Thr burner shuts off the circ continues to run and the temp stacks to 205. Using a Testo clampon temperature sensor above the pump the highest temperature I get is 186. I have the grungfos 15-58 set to zone valves and on speed one. If I turn the speed up the temperature on my Testo drops. High speed I was only reading 175 on my gauge. The pump is on the supply. The control was replaced just as a precaution. the sensor is bottomed out in the well.

A little backround information

The boiler is a one year old Wbv-04 with a tankless coil. Installed in a 2000 square foot split level ranch. Fired at the middle firing rate. It is a four zone system using honeywell zone valves 3/4" with 8 cv flow rate. System was cleaned with sentinel cleaner for a few hours then flushed and refilled. The system is very quiet no air noise. The radiation is all copper fin tube

EdTheHeaterMan

@RSB It would be a good idea to start your own discussion and post some photographs of the boiler from several angles, from far enough back to see the pipes from floor to ceiling. That will let us look at the near boiler piping. I have a feeling you may have some common piping that may be too small.

HVACNUT

If it's firing at 1.25 GPH. With a 131K output, that's 65.5 BTU's per square foot. It could heat 2 more houses of the same size.

What's the return water temperature at limit. Unobstructed baseboard?

Lock open all 4 zones and get temperature readings for each while they're all on. Are you using a clamp thermometer?

RSB

I'm going back to the house early next week. I will get some pictures of the system.

The baseboard isn't blocked any more than most homes. When I left the other night I advised the homeowner to pull all the covers and vacuum the baseboard. I am using a clamp on sensor. I agree there is plenty of boiler for this house. The return temp has been varying based on the supply temp. With the supply temp at 186 I have a 17+ degree delta, and as the supply temp falls off the delta drops to around 9. That was with all zones calling.

HVACNUT

You can squeeze about 40K BTU from 3/4 copper, and typical fin tube puts out 600 BTU per linear foot at I believe 190°. Measure?