Innovative?

DanHolohan

Here's a question for all of you:

Which company in the heating industry do you think is the most innovative these days as it applies to their products and/or ways of doing business?

I'd love to hear your thoughts. Thanks.

tim smith

Interesting question Dan. There are several companies that change products more often than others which may seem innovative. But in final outcome some are just fixing problems with original design. It's frustrating to see designs change so often that parts purchased for 1st version are then not usable on 2nd, 3rd, 4th. You end up with a lot of dead stock. Especially if you are a service company who believes in stocking parts for what they install. Still have a bunch of Heatmaker parts that need to be thrown out. Although we never sold a new Heatmaker in our lives. Just serviced many. 

clammy

As for conducting business I really don’t know but I will say ever bodies got a title or a position but not much responsibility or accountability for that position but as for innovation I would say Bosch n there heat pumps ,cross manifolds for there complete package w a great price point compared to building separates ,manifold ,zone valves or heads n a zone controller big savings . Thermostats w installers menus for system type . Taco exp zone n circ panels w pump valve exercise and of course sentry zone valves .As for the whole heating equipment side I don’t see much new advances in technology from a few years ago only that they as others have eluded change products and discontinue product lines so often that it leaves me to think that what I install today most likely will not exist in say 12 years and that seems to be across the board on just about everything on the mod con side as for cast iron not much has really changed except for thank god electronic aquastats. maybe the only things that will not change will be the pa404 and gorton vents even though steam is slowly and foolishly being replaced it think these 2 items may be around till the last steamer exists and then some .
Peace and good luck clammy

DanHolohan

Lots to consider with those answers, guys. Thanks.

I'd love to hear more thoughts.

STEVEusaPA

I think an easy, direct answer is Energy Kinetics. That's a complete re-imagining/re-designing the boiler (especially oil) different from everyone else. Plus their attention to detail, and customer support. A few other companies tried condensing oil (everywhere in Europe successfully) but kind of drop the ball on follow thru.

Caleffi is another one, always thinking, always experimenting, always innovating.

(PS, I didn't mean to imply EK was a condensing boiler).

DanHolohan

It really pays to listen to your customers, doesn’t it?  Listen to their problems, innovate solutions. 

Derheatmeister

https://www.innovativehydronics.net/

Robert O'Brien

STEVEusaPA said:

I think an easy, direct answer is Energy Kinetics. That's a complete re-imagining/re-designing the boiler (especially oil) different from everyone else. Plus their attention to detail, and customer support. A few other companies tried condensing oil (everywhere in Europe successfully) but kind of drop the ball on follow thru.

Caleffi is another one, always thinking, always experimenting, always innovating.

(PS, I didn't mean to imply EK was a condensing boiler).

I agree with Steve, Energy Kinetics is always looking forward and has a great record of bringing innovative products successfully to market. Webstone is another with loads of cool hydronic accessories.

RayWohlfarth

Dan,
You got my mind buzzing with this topic. I love innovation and trying new things as long as the innovating company can provide the same level of customer support or expertise. There is no more lonely place in the world than being in the customer's basement with no heat and trying to get the unit running and the customer asking over your shoulder, "How much longer?"

A troubling trend we are seeing is the building control system wants to control the firing rate of the burner rather than allow the boiler manufacturer to control the boiler. While this is innovative, I don't believe it serves the customer's best interest. The controls were fighting each other and would simply shut off the boiler at random times. This usually occurred at 3am on a Sunday night. It also happened on Thanksgiving, Easter, and Christmas Eve. The boiler manufacturer and the building control company blamed each other. After numerous calls to both companies, we resolved the problem by allowing the boiler company to control their boiler and firing rate and the building control company to simply enable or disable the boilers. As a result the system is operating the way it was intended. Innovation is great as long as there is customer support for the techs in the field.

This probably wasn't what you asked but it hit a nerve
Ray

DanHolohan

That’s innovative, Ray. Thanks!

JohnNY

@RayWohlfarth That's a great answer. Without naming names, I piped a product exactly as drawn in a manual recently and it didn't work well. A rep was dispatched and told me "Yeah, that's the way it's drawn in the manual, but it probably would work better xxxxxx way."
What?? Fix your manual, man! Or your product!

Do you remember when the Honeywell MCBA was the control for 3 or 4 different mod-cons? We were trying to figure out how to connect our laptops to it so we could get it to work.

Technology is best in moderation.

To stay something nice:
I'm always impressed with Lochinvar integral controls.
And the Burnham Steam Max is a good boiler design.

cross_skier

Midea U shaped inverter window AC.  First energy star rated window unit (15 Seer), super quiet (40db), and dirt cheap ($250+) on sale.  They're selling well.  If they can fix the app and add geofencing could be a game changer.

mattmia2

But does it retain its refrigerant indefinitely as something made out of solid metal and glass should?

hot_rod

Can't say enough about how the company I work for is an innovation leader. From Marco the owner down to the skilled workers on the factories floor. State of the art machines from around the world, constantly being upgraded as technology evolves.

Perhaps the most copied products in hydronics start at Caleffi.

To tag another thread.. the quality control and endless product testing is amazing. Yes it may cost a few bucks more, now you know why.

JohnNY

hot_rod said:

Can't say enough about how the company I work for is an innovation leader.

I'm also extremely impressed with Caleffi. Just from a design standpoint, they're a sorely needed level-up from some of the products we've been using for years.

Maybe when I grow up and get more experience in the field, Marco will hire me to be Caleffi liaison in New York. Mi ascolta, Marco? Aspetto la tua chiamata.

hot_rod

JohnNY said:

hot_rod said:

Can't say enough about how the company I work for is an innovation leader.

I'm also extremely impressed with Caleffi. Just from a design standpoint, they're a sorely needed level-up from some of the products we've been using for years.

Maybe when I grow up and get more experience in the field, Marco will hire me to be Caleffi liaison in New York. Mi ascolta, Marco? Aspetto la tua chiamata.

And I think of you every time the wine flows at a table in Italy.
Stay well

JohnNY

@Hotrod Wow. You went to Travaglini? Historic producer of a classic wine with deep roots in Northern Piemonte winemaking.