Click here to Find a Contractor in your area.
Welcome! Here are some tips for using this forum.
Need to contact us? Visit https://heatinghelp.com/contact-us/.

G125BE burner conversion from blue flame to Riello

Jesse53Jesse53 Posts: 9Member
edited September 7 in Oil Heating
Before you ask why I would do this please read. I bought a G125BE as suggested for the best possible oil efficiency. Once it was installed and I looked for a company to service it I found there are no trained tech with in the local businesses who do boiler service in the area. Those who have looked at it walk away saying they don't know the burner. I'm quite tired of trying to find help and the Dist rep is of now help as well as the supply house who sold the unit. Both say they sold me a good product. The rep suggests and says it can be converted with Riello burner C8512543 and states there are no other parts needed. Now before you ask or tell me to get a certified tech to answer this read back there are none in the area? You might also ask why the install company isn't certified and had training on this unit. Well no one said they had to be, the part was ordered by a mechanical contractor and a plumber installed the whole system and it's been up and running for 4 years now. So if anyone has been through this process or has knowledge of what parts other than the suggested burner I would like to hear from you. I'm told by local service companies if it gets a different burner they can and will work on it. One last thing I was told to remove all baffles except the lower right and left, by the rep.
Tagged:

Comments

  • STEVEusaPASTEVEusaPA Posts: 2,089Member
    Where are you located?
    steve
  • EBEBRATT-EdEBEBRATT-Ed Posts: 4,080Member
    if the rep can't find you a service provider for his own product he's not doing his job. something is amiss
  • Jamie HallJamie Hall Posts: 8,374Member
    I'm not trying to be snarky, but... isn't this a good example of what we so often preach? You aren't buying the equipment, you're buying the installation and the service down the road...
    Jamie



    Building superintendent/caretaker, 7200 sq. ft. historic house museum with dependencies in New England.



    Hoffman Equipped System (all original except boiler), Weil-Mclain 580, 2.75 gph Carlin, Vapourstat 0.5 -- 6.0 ounces per square inch
  • SteamheadSteamhead Posts: 12,215Member

    Where are you located?

    This, @Jesse53 . If anyone can help you out or find someone who can, it's us.
    All Steamed Up, Inc.
    "Reducing our country's energy consumption, one system at a time"
    Steam, Vapor & Hot-Water Heating Specialists
    Oil & Gas Burner Service
    Baltimore, MD (USA) and consulting anywhere.
    https://heatinghelp.com/find-a-contractor/detail/all-steamed-up-inc
  • Jesse53Jesse53 Posts: 9Member
    I'm in northern Vermont
  • Jesse53Jesse53 Posts: 9Member
    Jamie I don't disagree. How ever I converted from a hot air to boiler because I put an addition on and needed more output. At the time I had a service tech that came with when I bought the house. I asked him where I should shop for a new heat system. He sent me to the local plumbing supply house. I asked for info on their most efficient oil burning boiler. My service tech worked alone and couldn't install a whole system, radiation, controls, zone pumps, and indirect tank. So I found someone who would buy all the needed parts and do the job. He was one of 2 who said they could install but were not in the service field. At the time I thought with all the oil delivery folks around how hard could it be to find a service tech. Turns out to be harder than it would seem. As for the Buderus rep he did come up with a list of techs, most of whom were not trained and would not work on it. The only one he offered that had trained techs, says I'm not in their service area? They did come here once for a fail because I had not heat in the night one winter. However they didn't come until the next day, and I was told by them to convert so someone local could work on this. They also told me at any point they might refuse to come based on their work load within their area. I have several who say if converted to Riello they would service it? The supply house is offering the Riello burner at their cost but say that's all they will do for me. Buderus in NH offers nothing
  • Jesse53Jesse53 Posts: 9Member
    EBEBRATT-Ed wrote "if the rep can't find you a service provider for his own product he's not doing his job. something is amiss"

    Ed? Same as I said to Jamie don't disagree. However it's a fact and I been dealing with it for some time now. I'm looking for info on this conversion and what is needed to do it so I can have all the parts needed. To answer why me if asked? Because I have a couple techs who say they could convert if I get the parts. So question again is has anyone done this and what does it require. The rep said it can be and has been done. He claims all I need is the Riello burner C8512543. I feel there must be more? The cable coming to it has a plug which fits the Buderus blue flame burner so what is done here? Cut it off and do a hard wire? I'm not happy about spending extra for more a more efficient boiler and now looking at spending more to convert to something less. So again have you or anyone done this conversion and can you offer suggestions?

    Thanks Jesse
  • Jamie HallJamie Hall Posts: 8,374Member
    Oh dear, @Jesse53 -- which side of northern Vermont? Either side you are in a bit of a black hole when it comes to service -- although the St. Johnsbury side (you mention New Hampshire) is somewhat darker than the Burlington side... I honestly can't think of anyone right off hand that services either Buderus or Riello specifically up that way.

    I have not done that conversion, and most of the people I know of who are clever with that sort of thing are at least 5 hours away -- not too practical. Sorry...
    Jamie



    Building superintendent/caretaker, 7200 sq. ft. historic house museum with dependencies in New England.



    Hoffman Equipped System (all original except boiler), Weil-Mclain 580, 2.75 gph Carlin, Vapourstat 0.5 -- 6.0 ounces per square inch
  • Jesse53Jesse53 Posts: 9Member
    Jamie Thanks, no I'm on the Burlington side but all those suggested by the Buderus rep are a no go! Some because they are not trained on the blue flame, others are not servicing in my area. I mentioned NH because that's where Buderus HQ is in the east
  • EBEBRATT-EdEBEBRATT-Ed Posts: 4,080Member
    Burlington is a good sized city surprised there is no one there. I guess have it converted then you haven't got much choice.

    Clearly Buderus should provide better support. Call this guy he works for directly for Buderus and has done start-ups for me.

    Doug Lamprey 1-603-361-5439
  • HVACNUTHVACNUT Posts: 1,301Member
    The BE can easily be converted to a Riello. But I dont recognize the model you listed. A Riello BF3 or BF5 depending on whether you have a 3,4 or 5 section.
    I did one on a temporary basis once because the tech before me tried to remove the burner and smashed the porcelain blast tube against the block.
    It's the same exact casting as the G115, but yes, baffles will need to be removed or adjusted to bring up the stack temp.
    If you have the Logomatic 2107, then nothing else needs to be done.
    Get an OEM Riello for a G115/3, or /4 or /5 depending on what yours is. OEM is kind of important here because there are different blast tube lengths and insertion depths for each.
    Since combustion air should already be there, (in the lower right rear corner) you can easily connect it to the BF Riello or the F with the fresh air kit.
    Is it chimney or sidewall vented?
  • STEVEusaPASTEVEusaPA Posts: 2,089Member
    HVACNUT said:


    ...Get an OEM Riello for a G115/3, or /4 or /5 depending on what yours is. OEM is kind of important here because there are different blast tube lengths and insertion depths for each.
    ...

    Aren't there only two air tube lengths for Riello?
    BTW, it's a kinder, gentler oil burner world now-air tube vs. blast tube :).

    steve
  • Jesse53Jesse53 Posts: 9Member
    HVACNUT, Mine is 4 sections, it's a G125BE/28 so I guess the R40 F5 Riello is the right one. I have read where it needs to be a OEM which is "blue" in color for Buderus and not the "red".

    I'm not real happy to make this change for 2 reasons, (both lead to same) which is cost. First cost to convert and second more money for oil. I'm guessing loosing Blue flame function is only part and then removing these baffles is where the AFUE goes south?
  • Jesse53Jesse53 Posts: 9Member
    EBEBRATT, thanks for the name and number I will give him a call. There are only 2 tube lengths 6" and 10" the F3 & 5 are both listed with 6" but the F5 is also listed with 10" which I think is intended for the 5 section 140 BTU input
  • Jamie HallJamie Hall Posts: 8,374Member
    The only comments I'd have at this point is that both @EBEBRATT-Ed and @HVACNUT have given you excellent advice (no surprise, they are among the best people on here) and second that you shouldn't pay too much attention to "AFUE". It's about as reliable as the EPA mileage rating on a car. And your mileage may vary... there's a lot one can do to save on fuel costs, and the Riello and Buderus burners are close enough in real efficiency (not AFUE) as to make almost no difference -- if they are properly set up and adjusted.
    Jamie



    Building superintendent/caretaker, 7200 sq. ft. historic house museum with dependencies in New England.



    Hoffman Equipped System (all original except boiler), Weil-Mclain 580, 2.75 gph Carlin, Vapourstat 0.5 -- 6.0 ounces per square inch
  • Robert O'BrienRobert O'Brien Posts: 3,012Member
    edited September 9
    I wouldn't automatically remove the baffles. Whoever does it can determine whether some need to be removed after the Riello goes in. As long as you can maintain the proper OF draft, some or all may stay. Haven't worn the hat yet!
    To learn more about this professional, click here to visit their ad in Find A Contractor.
  • Jesse53Jesse53 Posts: 9Member
    Robert O'Brien. says, " I wouldn't automatically remove the baffles. Whoever does it can determine whether some need to be removed after the Riello goes in. As long as you can maintain the proper OF draft, some or all may stay. Haven't worn the hat yet! "
    Robert are you saying you have either done this ( remove baffles a pair at a time ) and check draft? Or you have heard of others doing this? If some remain that would be good for efficiency?
  • HVACNUTHVACNUT Posts: 1,301Member
    What baffles remain, get removed, or adjusted will be dependent on the combustion analysis. Too low stack temp, remove a set, or turn. The bottom baffles have 3 positions that can be adjusted.
    All variables for optimum efficiency with a stack temp high enough to prevent the flue gasses from condensing and maintaining a -.02 draft at the breach.
  • HVACNUTHVACNUT Posts: 1,301Member
    It's a cryin' shame nobody near you is certified for the BE. You (or somebody) paid a lot more for the 125BE over the G115.
    And it's too bad the BE never took off in the states because they are beautiful boilers and burners. Maybe everyone thought it would be like the original Blue Ray.
  • Jesse53Jesse53 Posts: 9Member
    HVACNUT, Yes this BE has been great except when it wouldn't fire and I had to look for someone to diagnose. I have talked to Buderus/Bosh and asked for the service book with codes to recover from faults. They act like I'm asking for a regulated drug. Not tooting my horn, but I could likely maintain this my self if I had the resources available to me. I even asked them to let me take the training class. I was a electronics tech for a career at IBM in town and worked on multi million dollar semi conductor with, all kinds of dangers, High voltage. RF power, deadly gases which if not purged out would kill you. But I guess because I don't work mech contractor I can't be trained? Frustrating! Yes it sucks I paid big bucks for the best and now have to pay to convert to something lessor.
  • Robert O'BrienRobert O'Brien Posts: 3,012Member
    Jesse53 said:

    Robert O'Brien. says, " I wouldn't automatically remove the baffles. Whoever does it can determine whether some need to be removed after the Riello goes in. As long as you can maintain the proper OF draft, some or all may stay. Haven't worn the hat yet! "
    Robert are you saying you have either done this ( remove baffles a pair at a time ) and check draft? Or you have heard of others doing this? If some remain that would be good for efficiency?

    You want a -.02 to .03 at breech and a +.04 to .06 overfire. Try it with all baffles in place and if needed reposition or remove baffles as needed to get where you want to be.
    To learn more about this professional, click here to visit their ad in Find A Contractor.
  • Robert O'BrienRobert O'Brien Posts: 3,012Member
    Jesse53 said:

    HVACNUT, Yes this BE has been great except when it wouldn't fire and I had to look for someone to diagnose. I have talked to Buderus/Bosh and asked for the service book with codes to recover from faults. They act like I'm asking for a regulated drug. Not tooting my horn, but I could likely maintain this my self if I had the resources available to me. I even asked them to let me take the training class. I was a electronics tech for a career at IBM in town and worked on multi million dollar semi conductor with, all kinds of dangers, High voltage. RF power, deadly gases which if not purged out would kill you. But I guess because I don't work mech contractor I can't be trained? Frustrating! Yes it sucks I paid big bucks for the best and now have to pay to convert to something lessor.

    It's been discontinued for 5 years or so, I can't imagine they even offer a class at this point. Download the manuals and get the service kit. Stock some parts and get a combustion analyzer and give it a go if you feel confident. The problem is the cost of that will never be recouped through the 3% greater combustion efficiency.
    To learn more about this professional, click here to visit their ad in Find A Contractor.
  • HVACNUTHVACNUT Posts: 1,301Member
    Sounds like you can tackle it but you need a digital combustion analyzer. The only way to properly adjust the BE burner is using the chart in the manual to get a specific CO2 at the current combustion air temperature (from outside) by adjusting the pump pressure.
    And only use the nozzle specified for your boiler. Hago RFD.
Sign In or Register to comment.

Welcome

It looks like you're new here. If you want to get involved, click one of these buttons!