Hydronic retrofit

JSAlaska

I have been browsing this site and others for a little bit and feel like I have a baseline of knowledge to jump in and ask some questions.

Some background:

I am remodeling a house we recently purchased in Anchorage, AK. Right now, we're focusing on the kitchen, living room, and dining room, as well as a hallway that leads to these rooms (see attached layout). The total area is roughly 1200 sqf. The house has a great, walk-in crawlspace that makes for easy maintenance and utilities access. The plan is to install a combination of slate/stone tile and hardwood in the areas we're remodeling (most likely slate in the kitchen and living room with hardwood in the dining room and hallway). The house has a fairly efficient natural gas forced air furnace but I don't like forced air, especially with how much it dries out the air in Alaska in winter. The living room has a cathedral ceiling that goes from 8' at the walls to 13' at the peak.

We'd like to do an above floor hydronic system in the living room, kitchen, dining room, and likely the hallway as well (the adjoining rooms are carpeted and will stay that way). I am trying to keep costs down and have the tools and experience to at least install panels/boards and PEX tubing myself. I have considered putting a new subfloor over the existing 3/4" ply and either routing channels or cutting the new subfloor into sleeper strips. I have also looked at buying aluminum heat transfer plates to install along with the new subfloor. But the aluminum plates all seem to be a very light gauge and I'm not sure if they're as efficient and effective as warmboard, ecowarm, roth, rauboard, etc. It is also hard to find decent heat transfer plates -- most seem to have manufacturing defects of one type or another.

Questions:
1) Do I need to do a heat loss calculation if the forced air furnace is going to stay in place? Is there any reason to do one? The forced air will still serve a first floor bed room and den as well as the second floor.

2) Would a DIY system with a new plywood subfloor and aluminum transfer plates be as effective and efficient as warmboard, ecowarm and similar poducts?

3) Without getting into specific pricing, Ecowarm seems to be the most affordable for what I'm considering and would make for an easy retrofit. Being in Oregon, they also have reasonable shipping to Alaska.

4) I am on a well and will have to get a water softener and likely a water filter as well (manganese issues among others). Assuming these systems are effective and remove the contaminants, will the presence of the softener and filter have any impact on the design of the hydronic system? Stupid question, but I figured I'd ask.

5) The house has two 40 gallon hot water heaters that are 15-years-old and likely coated in all the things that the broken water softener didn't take out. What's the practicality of doing a single boiler for the hydronics and hot water heater all in one go? (admittedly, I need to read more about how this works).

6) I certainly do not have the experience or knowledge to design the whole system and have had trouble finding an online service to send the layout and info. provided above for a design. Are there any online services that do this without buying a specific manufacturer's product?

7) Any general advice, input, places to start, glaring issues not to overlook? I figure a designer can help with the best PEX spacing, PEX diameter, manifold placement, and similar issues, some of which may require a heat loss calc.

Thanks in advance for any input

newagedawn

q#1 no

Henry

Radiant heat does not work with carpets
1) You will need to send your request for design aand heat loss to a manufacturer od radiant piping and accessories.
2)DIY does not work in real life
3)Your choice
4)You need to contact a local water specialist.
5)You could use a boiler like HTP with one of their SSP S/S indirect tanks
6)You have to hire a professional that works with one of the radiant manufacturers. They design the system.
7) see 6

hot_rod

There are some good hydronic contractors up there. Nathan White is out On the Kenai White Plbg and heating he may be able to consult or steer you to someone local. He is great for unique jobs and clever designs

JSAlaska

Henry said:

2)DIY does not work in real life

4)You need to contact a local water specialist.

6)You have to hire a professional that works with one of the radiant manufacturers. They design the system.

Henry, thanks for the input. We wouldn't be installing any radiant under carpeted sections of the house. We're considering re-flooring and adding radiant to the carpeted rooms (bedroom with bathroom and a den) as a separate zone down the line.

As to (2), that's more or less what I figured and it seems like the added time and not having a design service tailored to a specific product would be too risky/not worth it.

On (4), we had water tested by an independent lab. Very high manganese (10 times recommended max), high iron (1.5 times recommended max), and some calcium and magnesium (hard water bordering on very hard). All in all, bad water. We'll be doing a filter and softener to address those issues, considering it'll be a whole house system, it'll take care of anything before hitting the boiler.

(6) I'd like to at least lay the Ecowarm, Warmboard, or Raupanels myself to save money and click the pex line into place. I'd definitely hire a professional to install the boiler, connect everything, etc. This seems practical and reasonable if the installer is okay with it.

Thanks for your thoughts

JSAlaska

hot rod said:

There are some good hydronic contractors up there. Nathan White is out On the Kenai White Plbg and heating he may be able to consult or steer you to someone local. He is great for unique jobs and clever designs

Thanks for the recommendation. I just looked up White's Plumbing and Heating and will see if they have any recommendations locally. I've also looked into Circle Plumbing and Heating (seem to be expensive) and Moore Heating. Any experience or knowledge of either. Thanks

hot_rod

try mitch@pacwestsalesinc.com
He reps hydronic products up around that area, he would know of some locals to contact.